FS_Meteo & WideFS on 10MBit network

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

finally I have setup my new FS-computer with FS9, WideFS, FSUIPC and PFC (WideClient and FS_Meteo are running on the ICS host). Editing of the INI files was easy and everything worked satisfying from the beginning. You have done a really great job on this !

There are a few things though I would like to hear your opinion about.

1. Today I landed at Aalborg (EKYT) and there were clear skies and wind 217°/14 kts allthough the metar decoder in FS_Meteo reported wind 270°/16kts, three cloud layers (2 of them BKN) and showers of rain. Do you think this can be related to FS's interpolation between the nearest stations. After landing I saved the flight and when I reloaded that the weather was right. Should I rather report this to Marc?

2. My network is not the fastest (Coax cable, 10MBit/sec). Everything I do in FS_Meteo takes quite a long time (setting the destination airport for instance). Also updating the weather after a position change takes some time. I did a test where I loaded FS9, started WideClient and then did 3 position changes via world menu "go to airport".

This is what the log files say:

********* WideServer.DLL Log [version 6.10] *********

Using blocksize guide of 4096 bytes

Date (dmy): 10/10/03, Time 17:34:21.203: Server name is FLUSI

34406 Initialising server socket now

34438 Incoming connection Accepted ok (skt=2864)

34547 Connected to computer "FRANK" (skt=2864)

647938 Shutdown broadcast requested by hotkey!

647985 Shutdown request received!

648344 Client socket disconnected at Client: removing (skt=2864)

655985 Closing down now ...

Memory managed: Offset records: 33 alloc, 33 free

Throughput maximum achieved: 17 frames/sec, 915 bytes/sec

Throughput average achieved for complete session: 3 frames/sec, 159 bytes/sec

********* Log file closed *********

********* WideClient.DLL Log [version 6.10] Class=FS98MAIN *********

Date (dmy): 10/10/03, Time 17:33:34.020: Client name is FRANK

62 Attempting to connect now

1626 Error on client pre-Connection Select() [Error=10061] Connection refused

1785 Ready to try connection again

1795 Attempting to connect now

5460 New Client Application: "FS_METEO" (Id=-348867)

13228 Connection made okay!

201656 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1258 jumped to 1260

207505 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1313 jumped to 1315

500461 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3812 jumped to 3814

506330 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3904 jumped to 3906

506945 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3913 jumped to 3915

513011 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3997 jumped to 3999

515256 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4027 jumped to 4029

519355 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4076 jumped to 4078

626858 Shutdown request received!

627091 Reception maximum achieved: 17 frames/sec, 961 bytes/sec

627091 Reception average achieved whilst connected: 8 frames/sec, 339 bytes/sec

627091 Max receive buffer = 386, Max send depth = 3

627091 ********* Log file closed (Buffers: MaxUsed 3, Alloc 6660 Freed 6660 Refused 0) *********

The framerate limiter in FS9 is set to 15.

Is there anything I could set in the INI files to improve things, should I just leave it as it is or is a better network the only solution?

Regards

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

Today I landed at Aalborg (EKYT) and there were clear skies and wind 217°/14 kts allthough the metar decoder in FS_Meteo reported wind 270°/16kts, three cloud layers (2 of them BKN) and showers of rain. Do you think this can be related to FS's interpolation between the nearest stations. After landing I saved the flight and when I reloaded that the weather was right. Should I rather report this to Marc?

It sounds like weather dynamics rather than interpolation.

I'm really rather baffled by some things that happen in FS2004's weather system. Certainly, if FSMeteo set the weather at EKYT some time before, then the weather is likely to be somewhat different when you get there. Clouds blow away, wind directions change as the air mass moves. However, if FSM has set the EKYT shortly before your arrival it should be okay.

These changes seem to occur even if the Weather dynamics slider in FS is set to minimum or not (FS Meteo by defaults sets it to minimum). If it is set to give changes they occur even faster.

Did you tune into and get ATIS weather reporting? As in the real world I tend to think that's the only way you can deal with the more real weather in FS2004.

My network is not the fastest (Coax cable, 10MBit/sec). Everything I do in FS_Meteo takes quite a long time (setting the destination airport for instance). Also updating the weather after a position change takes some time.

Well, for something as heavy as FSMeteo a 10Mbps network is really asking for trouble. There's a lot of data needed for all those weather stations it sets.

But even so, FSM will always take some time. This is because, for each weather station, FSM has to send the data, then wait for FSUIPC to confirm it. FSUIPC only does this at most on each FS frame, and more likely every few frames. This is partly to avoid stopping FS whilst the weather is being set, and partly to make the data management facilities in FSUIPC more usable. When you get 50-100 weather stations being set (and in crowded parts of the world this is possible) it will take many seconds.

However, FSMeteo is cunningly designed to set your nearest stations first, then it gets further and further afield. If you are preparing a flight at your departure airport it should be pretty well ready by departure time.

The only alternative to this sort of approach is to do the same as FS's own downloads -- load the whole world's weather before you start, then disconnect, or just feed small updates every 15 minutes. I can provide a "bulk load" option, probably via a file, but I really don't see the point and no developer actually asked for this.

Anyway, the answer is -- yes, a faster network is really needed for this sort of application, but, no, you won't necessarily get the weather being set that much faster (though you haven't actually said how long it takes). Maybe FSMeteo wouldn't do so many retries.

I did a test where I loaded FS9, started WideClient and then did 3 position changes via world menu "go to airport".

Well, unless you stay put for a few minutes you should not expect any external weather program, designed to try to set your weather almost imperceptibly as you use the Sim, to keep up.

I don't like these blocks getting lost much:

201656 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1258 jumped to 1260

207505 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1313 jumped to 1315

500461 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3812 jumped to 3814

506330 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3904 jumped to 3906

506945 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3913 jumped to 3915

513011 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3997 jumped to 3999

515256 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4027 jumped to 4029

519355 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4076 jumped to 4078

You shouldn't be losing blocks like this. If it happens regularly I'd check your network cards. Of course it might just be that the data was piling up in the Send buffers on the Server because the Client couldn't get data out fast enough. however, this doesn't seem that plausible.

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

It sounds like weather dynamics rather than interpolation.

I don't think so. Dynamics were turned off, at least that's what the FS weather menu said.

I'm really rather baffled by some things that happen in FS2004's weather system.

So am I :D , but it doesn't matter so much. The weather is changing as I fly and it is somewhat realistc so that's OK for me.

The only alternative to this sort of approach is to do the same as FS's own downloads -- load the whole world's weather before you start, then disconnect,

That's what I'm already doing. "download weather without FS and exit" while reading emails and so on.

Anyway, the answer is -- yes, a faster network is really needed for this sort of application,

I was afraid it would turn out this way. Unfortunately this is not an option for me at the moment.

I don't like these blocks getting lost much:

201656 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1258 jumped to 1260

207505 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 1313 jumped to 1315

500461 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3812 jumped to 3814

506330 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3904 jumped to 3906

506945 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3913 jumped to 3915

513011 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 3997 jumped to 3999

515256 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4027 jumped to 4029

519355 GetRecv() missed block? Sequence 4076 jumped to 4078

You shouldn't be losing blocks like this. If it happens regularly I'd check your network cards.

It happens regularly - also if I use the same setup with FS2002. But to be honest - I don't know what to check. TCP/IP is the only protocol installed, unique IP adresses are assigned to all computers and all normal network functions (ping, file sharing, printing, internet connection sharing) work pefectly.

Of course it might just be that the data was piling up in the Send buffers on the Server because the Client couldn't get data out fast enough.

Let's think this is the reason :wink:

Anyway I'm not very concerned about it. As I said in my first post all works well enough to be satisfying. I just wanted to make shur I've done everything I can. Thanks for your support.

Regards,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

I don't think so. Dynamics were turned off, at least that's what the FS weather menu said.

As I said, even with it off the weather is dynamic. i said that in my reply, but for a longer discussion on the subject please see the notes on this in the IMPORTANT announcement above, or at the end of the FSUIPC user guide.

That's what I'm already doing. "download weather without FS and exit"

No,no. You misunderstand. That is what you are telling FSMeteo to do. But then it feeds weather into FS as you fly. For it to inject all the weather into FS at the start then disappear is something else entirely.

But to be honest - I don't know what to check. TCP/IP is the only protocol installed, unique IP adresses are assigned to all computers and all normal network functions (ping, file sharing, printing, internet connection sharing) work pefectly.

When I say "check the network cards" I mean swap them about, change them, replace them. You say that upgrading to 100 Mbps is not an option. I'm sorry about that, though I see 10/100 auto network cards so cheap these days, cheaper even than FSUIPC! :D In fact a decent Cat5 cable is sometimes more than the Network card!

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

No,no. You misunderstand. That is what you are telling FSMeteo to do. But then it feeds weather into FS as you fly. For it to inject all the weather into FS at the start then disappear is something else entirely.

Ah I see. An interesting thought. Should be kept in mind I think. I've allways been loking for a weather program that can set all the weatherstations at once thus creating a *.WX file to save with the flight. I found one back in FS2000 times. It was called "Wetter2000" by Klaus Prichatz but I found it somehow difficult to handle so I went for FS_Meteo finally.

When I say "check the network cards" I mean swap them about, change them, replace them. You say that upgrading to 100 Mbps is not an option. I'm sorry about that, though I see 10/100 auto network cards so cheap these days, cheaper even than FSUIPC! :D In fact a decent Cat5 cable is sometimes more than the Network card!

Well it's not about the network cards or the switch/hub. The cards are capable of 100Mbps. It's about the cable. My home network ist spread across the entire house from the basement to the rooftop so the use of coax cable was the easiest way to do it simply going from one computer to the next. Changing to 100Mbps would include a lot of work witch I haven'got the time for at least at the moment.

Anyway - I'll think it over :)

All the best to you

Regards,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

Ah I see. An interesting thought. Should be kept in mind I think. I've allways been loking for a weather program that can set all the weatherstations at once

Well of course you can use FS's own downloads for that. They're not at all as bad as they used to be in previous versions.

Well it's not about the network cards or the switch/hub. The cards are capable of 100Mbps. It's about the cable. My home network ist spread across the entire house from the basement to the rooftop so the use of coax cable was the easiest way to do it simply going from one computer to the next. Changing to 100Mbps would include a lot of work witch I haven'got the time for at least at the moment.

Oh, I see. Yes, indeed that must be a consideration.

Even so, assuming that your FSMeteo PC and FS PC are not so far apart, it might be worthwhile using 100mpbs between just those two. Or can't you mix things like that? I don't really know. Alternatively I suppose you could just put another Network card in each of those two and leave the 10 mbps Network in place as well.

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Good morning Pete,

Even so, assuming that your FSMeteo PC and FS PC are not so far apart, it might be worthwhile using 100mpbs between just those two. Or can't you mix things like that? I don't really know. Alternatively I suppose you could just put another Network card in each of those two and leave the 10 mbps Network in place as well.

that's what I'm thinking about right now. I'm not to much into networking so I' ll go and ask my computer specialist on monday. He can shurely find a solution.

Thank you very much.

Regards,

Frank