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pete_agreatguy

T3D KPHX Phoenix issues

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Had a multiplayer session a few days ago on Phoenix; and came across the following issues:

Notes: Used @crbascott's custom schedule found here; however these are occuring with the default RT one as well.

1) Gate Pushback issues (aircraft pushing back incorrectly):

DAL136 pushbacked in a unconventional way. Couldn't get a good screenshot myself as I was doing tower.

1416435818_tower3d2018-10-1314-08-56-67.thumb.jpg.0e737761973e48ac236272f3aa6a54c2.jpg

AAL2189 appeared to pushback from the wrong gate causing issues on pushback:

1013531480_tower3d2018-10-1314-14-45-96.thumb.jpg.e7770c6cf147b92295dffde8291b1deb.jpg

SWA3037 had major pushback issues, including blocking taxiways.

1370843731_tower3d2018-10-1314-17-02-55.thumb.jpg.d450e993a8fbc26c3a5442953a2aa5b6.jpg

2) Serious issues with aircraft not exiting onto taxiway B7 when landing on runway 8.

It's not a taxiway connection issue. This issue seems to be linked to landing distances of some aircraft (mainly CRJ's):

ASH5954 (CR9) did not exit at B7 but again left onto A7. B8 would have been preferred if not B7:

615505080_tower3d2018-10-1314-50-57-33.thumb.jpg.3587394cde599ef1843015ca7ea1c743.jpg

AAL1169 (B738) managed to exit at B7. Around time index 14:07:15.

DAL947 (B717) managed to exit onto B7. Around time index 14:12:42.

ASH5957 (CR9) did not exit at B7 but again left onto A7. B8 would have been preferred if not B7

746401354_tower3d2018-10-1315-38-54-59.thumb.jpg.2c2f724b15c96c019ff5472a690489dc.jpg

AAL2342 (B738) managed to exit onto B7 at around 14:30:00.

NOTE: I tried using both the commands "[callsign] exit at taxiway bravo 7" and "[callsign] vacate runway right onto taxiway bravo 7" with the same results. See log file below for more details:

output_log.txt

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15 minutes ago, FeelThere Ariel said:

Pete, is this happening only on multiplayer or also in single player? 

Single vs. multiplayer mode makes no difference. It doesn't affect landing distances nor the way planes pushback. 🙄

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8 hours ago, pete_agreatguy said:

NOTE: I tried using both the commands "[callsign] exit at taxiway bravo 7" and "[callsign] vacate runway right onto taxiway bravo 7" with the same results. See log file below for more details:

output_log.txt

Not undermining the fact that there is issues at Phoenix, as Cl30 has mentioned before with Southwest, and that i believe G5 is not drawn, but could you not exit at B8 with the CR?

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2 hours ago, hexzed said:

Not undermining the fact that there is issues at Phoenix, as Cl30 has mentioned before with Southwest, and that i believe G5 is not drawn, but could you not exit at B8 with the CR?

I was expecting this to happen with "ASH5954" and "ASH5957".

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Not able to exit at B7 has nothing to do with the airport, but has everything to do with the landing distances of the planes as defined by Real Traffic. I don't know if any of these have been changed, but in prior analysis I found the following landing distances for the planes mentioned in Pete's #2.  

B738 - 4600 ft

B717 - 4660 ft

CRJ9 - 5235 ft.

I personally don't see this as a "serious issue", but since you brought it up @pete_agreatguy what should the landing distances be? Is the distance for the CRJ9 too long or the B738 and B717 too short?

Also, remember these same distances are used at all the airports including KSFO where we all think the planes exit unrealistically early. 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, crbascott said:

I personally don't see this as a "serious issue", but since you brought it up @pete_agreatguy what should the landing distances be? Is the distance for the CRJ9 too long or the B738 and B717 too short?

Also, remember these same distances are used at all the airports including KSFO where we all think the planes exit unrealistically early.

http://www.airliners.net/aircraft-data

Great link :)

See that is the issue. When the developers change one setting for one airport it affects the rest like we have all observed. So before and airport is released there are already issues in place.

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The problem we found with the CRJ's was that with the landing distance being that long, getting outbounds out in-between gaps was impossible. 

According to Bombardier, the CRJ700 has a landing field length of 5,040ft, the CRJ900 is 5,260ft and the CRJ1000 is 5,740ft:

http://commercialaircraft.bombardier.com/en/fleet-solutions/crj-series

It's got me puzzled because it is impossible to get outbounds rolling after lining up and waiting for these specific CRJ aircraft to leave the runway in order for takeoff clearance before the next landing aircraft.

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26 minutes ago, pete_agreatguy said:

Yep, enjoy the site. Where are the landing distances?

24 minutes ago, pete_agreatguy said:

The problem we found with the CRJ's was that with the landing distance being that long, getting outbounds out in-between gaps was impossible. 

According to Bombardier, the CRJ700 has a landing field length of 5,040ft, the CRJ900 is 5,260ft and the CRJ1000 is 5,740ft:

But the landing distance being used by RT is less than what you quoted. So, is the issue the landing distance or the oft-mentioned runway taxiing speed issue?

I know it's not as much fun, but in reality they really don't shoot gaps much at KPHX. Most departures are off 7L. 

 

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It sounds like the landing distance is correct, its just the taxiing speed as ever is to slow.

For realism's sake, the landing distance should be kept as is, should it not?

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53 minutes ago, pete_agreatguy said:

I was expecting this to happen with "ASH5954" and "ASH5957".

I meant could you command an exit at B8, or would it not take that?

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11 hours ago, crbascott said:

Yep, enjoy the site. Where are the landing distances?

But the landing distance being used by RT is less than what you quoted. So, is the issue the landing distance or the oft-mentioned runway taxiing speed issue?

Seems that it is more the latter (taxiing speeds). It's certainly an issue at EDDM, JKF (22L), Boston (every runway), KSAN, ... sod it ... just about every airport for that matter.

11 hours ago, hexzed said:

It sounds like the landing distance is correct, its just the taxiing speed as ever is to slow.

For realism's sake, the landing distance should be kept as is, should it not?

Agreed with the landing distance. Quite shocked at it tbh for a CRJ. However as I discussed last night with someone through PM, a pilot in reality, can exit at a closer taxiway if they apply more reverse thrust and a higher braking setting.

11 hours ago, hexzed said:

I meant could you command an exit at B8, or would it not take that?

Could do but as discussed was expecting the CRJ's to exit onto B7 if not B8 if they couldn't make B7.

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Since we're on the topic of aircraft performance, maybe someone could address the *cough* insanely slow *cough* acceleration of some of the corporate jets on takeoff.  You'd think they were a 747, lol. 

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9 hours ago, pete_agreatguy said:

Could do but as discussed was expecting the CRJ's to exit onto B7 if not B8 if they couldn't make B7.

Yeah i see what you mean now, they should turn towards the terminal, not away from it 

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8 hours ago, CL30 said:

Since we're on the topic of aircraft performance, maybe someone could address the *cough* insanely slow *cough* acceleration of some of the corporate jets on takeoff.  You'd think they were a 747, lol. 

That is a right laugh at KLAS lol

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