Jump to content
The simFlight Network Forums

Elevator Trim Offset Control


Recommended Posts

I am trying to get the elevator trim to work as I want it to!  (FSX SE/Alabeo Aztec)    It is much too slow using the button assignment to a button on my Honeycomb yoke and I found a very old post which seems to offer a solution.  It was the same subject in June 2013 to/from a guy called John Fee.  I have followed his approach and as you can see below from the .ini file I have used the offset for the elev trim.

My problem is that if I reduce the increment (256) and then fly, nothing seems to change and on checking I find that the adjusted increment (eg 128) has disappeared and been replaced with 256.   Can you help?  Has something changed since 2013 - I know a lot of things have!

Thanks in anticipation, Pete.


[Buttons.Alabeo Aztec]
0=RA,10,C65607,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_DN}-
1=RA,12,C65615,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_UP}-
5=RA,14,C65607,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_DN}-
6=RA,15,C65615,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_UP}-
12=RA,1,C66243,0     -{INC_COWL_FLAPS}-
36=RA,13,C65615,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_UP}-
38=RA,0,C66244,0     -{DEC_COWL_FLAPS}-
48=PC,0,C66856,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_6}-
49=UC,0,C66851,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_1}-
52=PC,3,C65561,0     -{PAUSE_TOGGLE}-
53=PC,10,C66858,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_8}-
54=UC,10,C66851,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_1}-
58=PA,3,C65758,0     -{FLAPS_INCR}-
60=PA,4,C66079,0     -{GEAR_UP}-
61=PA,5,C66080,0     -{GEAR_DOWN}-
62=PA,2,C65759,0     -{FLAPS_DECR}-
63=RC,7,C66855,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_5}-
65=PC,6,C66857,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_7}-
66=PC,11,C66859,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_9}-
67=UC,11,C66851,0     -{VIEW_CAMERA_SELECT_1}-
72=PC,28,C66052,0     -{STROBES_ON}-
73=PC,29,C66053,0     -{STROBES_OFF}-
74=PA,6,C66416,0     -{PAN_VIEW}-
75=PC,20,C66239,0     -{TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS}-
76=PC,21,C66239,0     -{TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS}-
77=PC,22,C66059,0     -{LANDING_LIGHTS_ON}-
78=PC,23,C66060,0     -{LANDING_LIGHTS_OFF}-
79=PC,24,C66240,0     -{TOGGLE_TAXI_LIGHTS}-
80=PC,25,C66240,0     -{TOGGLE_TAXI_LIGHTS}-
81=PC,26,C66379,0     -{TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS}-
82=PC,27,C66379,0     -{TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS}-
83=PC,1,C66579,0     -{TOGGLE_CABIN_LIGHTS}-
84=RC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC0010100     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=256, Limit=-16383)}-
85=RC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF0100     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=256, Limit=16383)}-
86=PF,4,C66079,0     -{GEAR_UP}-
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, rojo2021 said:

My problem is that if I reduce the increment (256) and then fly, nothing seems to change and on checking I find that the adjusted increment (eg 128) has disappeared and been replaced with 256.   Can you help?  Has something changed since 2013 - I know a lot of things have!

How are you changing the increment/decrement delta value?

This is the assignment line for decrement:

2 hours ago, rojo2021 said:

84=RC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC0010100     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=256, Limit=-16383)}-

The delta value is what I have highlighted (0100 hex = 256 decimal). The descriptive text is a comment - you cannot change the value there.
Really you should change in the assignments dialog, but you can also change the value in the ini if you like. However, it is confusing that you say the trim wheel action is too slow, but you want to reduce the delta from 256 to 128 which would make it twice as slow!! To speed it up, you need to increase the delta.

If using a buttons for trim, you can also try lua scripts which can distinguish between a short button ptess (for a small inc/dec) and a long button press (for a larger and repeated in/dec). There is a generic triple-use lua script for buttons that you can use (will obviously need modifying!) here: 

There is also the example Rotaries.lua that you can use, which is for single button rotaries (in each direction) which is the same as using two buttons, so you can adapt that for your needs. I recently adapted this for the Honeycomb Bravo, but you could also do something similar to use the buttons on your alpha in a similar way:

Yet another trick folks use is to duplicate (or triple.quadruple) there assignments, so it sends the same control 2, 3 or 4 times. This works ok for fast movement, and maybe ok for trim, but I woukd onkly do that if using double or truple use in the button, so a long press would result in duplicate large delta controls being sent, but a single press would result in just one smaller inc/dec being sent.
I am using the Bravo for trim. and here are my ini entries (FYI):

Quote

52=P64,6,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=125, Limit=16383)}-
53=P64,7,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF00FA     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=250, Limit=16383)}-
54=P64,4,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=125, Limit=-16383)}-
55=P64,5,Cx42000BC0,xC00100FA     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=250, Limit=-16383)}-
56=U64,7,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF00FA     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=250, Limit=16383)}-
57=U64,5,Cx42000BC0,xC00100FA     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=250, Limit=-16383)}-

In those assignments, my two physical buttons for in/dec have been converted to 4 vurtual buttons, one for slow in, one for fast in, one for slow dec, and one for fast dec, and then my fast assignments have been duplicated (i.e. being sent on press and release in my case).

Hope that helps and isn't too confusing....
 

John

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, it went so I'll try to repeat my previous message.

The original button assignment through FSUIIPC was too slow.  The offset was much faster and I have now slowed that thanks to your help.  Presumably I can now delete the entries in the .ini file for other elev trim lines without finding I've upset something else.

The idea of being able to tweak the trim setting by using a single press really appeals so I'm going to try to fathom that now.

Regards,

Roger

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 weeks later...

Hi John,

After digesting what you suggested I thought I would try to replicate the entry you posted from your own ini file to get the slow entry to the trim up/dn.  If I understood correctly a short press would give me small adjustments to trim and for bigger changes I hold down.  That right?

I attach my ini where I have added the amended entries - my yoke is 'C' .  My buttons are 4 and 5 for elevator trim.  I also attach the log file showing button presses.

However I only get the first action either inc or dec, and only the small amount (125) and nothing more if I hold the button down.  Should there be a Repeat somewhere here?

Any help appreciated as always,

Roger

 

FSUIPC4.log FSUIPC4.ini

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, rojo2021 said:

After digesting what you suggested I thought I would try to replicate the entry you posted from your own ini file to get the slow entry to the trim up/dn.  If I understood correctly a short press would give me small adjustments to trim and for bigger changes I hold down.  That right?

I don't think so - which post are you referring to?  Setting up trim depends on the type of button/switch/rotary/wheel you are using. I have posted various times on this for different set-ups - 1 or 2 button wheel or rotaries usually...

Your ini has:

Quote

84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=125, Limit=16383)}-
85=PC,6,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF00FA     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=250, Limit=16383)}-
86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=125, Limit=-16383)}-
87=PC,7,Cx42000BC0,xC00100FA     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=250, Limit=-16383)}-
88=UC,6,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF00FA     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=250, Limit=16383)}-
89=UC,7,Cx42000BC0,xC00100FA     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=250, Limit=-16383)}-

Your log shows that you only clicked buttons 4 and 5:

Quote

    83453 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
    83453 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
    83453 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D
    83672 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Released
    84016 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
    84016 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
    84016 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D
    84235 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Released
    84453 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
    84453 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
    84453 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D
    84641 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Released
    86235 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    86235 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    86235 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    86578 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    86766 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    86766 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    86766 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    87047 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    87313 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    87313 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    87313 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    87594 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    89328 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    89328 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    89328 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    89641 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    89844 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    89844 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    89844 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    90156 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    90313 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    90313 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    90313 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    90625 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    91641 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    91641 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    91641 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    91922 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    92110 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    92110 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    92110 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    92406 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    92594 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    92594 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    92594 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    92875 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    94766 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    94766 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    94766 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    95063 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    95219 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    95219 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    95219 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    95500 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    95625 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    95625 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    95625 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    95844 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    95969 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    95969 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    95969 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    96188 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    96360 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    96360 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    96360 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    96610 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    96735 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    96735 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    96735 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
    97110 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
    98563 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
    98563 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
    98563 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
   101313 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
   102672 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
   102672 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
   102672 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
   102969 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
   103188 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Pressed
   103188 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 84=PC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF007D
   103188 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x3200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=x3FFF007D
   103469 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=4, Released
   107547 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
   107547 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
   107547 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D
   107797 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Released
   108031 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
   108031 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
   108031 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D
   108313 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Released
   108563 Button changed: bRef=0, Joy=2 (C), Btn=5, Pressed
   108563 [Buttons.Alabeo PA23 Aztec F 250 F-BALY] 86=PC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC001007D
   108563 IPC Offsets Control: Ctrl=x4200, Length=2, Offset=0BC0, Param=xC001007D

So at no point did you activate the buttons for which you have the larger delta (256) assigned, buttons 6 and 7.

So, I think you copied something that maybe doesn't apply. Note that I also use a lua script that converts my 2-button trim wheel (up/down) to 4 virtual buttons (slow up, slow down, fat up, fast down).

The easiest way to control the trim via buttons is how you previously had it, assigning to the trim offset with a suitable inc/dec and on repeat. If you want the trim delta to change depending upon the button repeat (or how long you are holding the button), you would have to do this using lua. For example, you could adapt the 'generic triple use lua for buttons' script (available in the User Contributions section) to have a slow inc/dec on a single button press, a larger (repeated) one on a long button press.
Alternatively, some folks like to use compound conditions, so that the delta is small (128) when you click the buttons on their own, but increases if you click when you have another button (or key) pressed, then this triggers the same control but with a larger delta (i.e. 256). You can do it this way using compound assignments, explained in the Advanced User guide.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks John,

Yes, I did take something out of context and it didn't work.  For the sake of sanity I'm going to take the simple, simple route and use four physical buttons, two with the fast trim delta (256) and two with the slower one.  This way I can get back to actually flying.  I can then experiment separately with trying the sophisticated method(s).

I appreciate your patience.  Each time I do learn something new!  All the best.

Roger

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, rojo2021 said:

For the sake of sanity I'm going to take the simple, simple route and use four physical buttons, two with the fast trim delta (256) and two with the slower one.  This way I can get back to actually flying.  I can then experiment separately with trying the sophisticated method(s).

Ok, sounds like a good plan. But, trim control via 2 buttons (up/down) is quite a common issue. I am sure there are various solutions posted somewhere in this forum, maybe in User Contributions or from similar support requests in the main forum.

I should probably add trim control assignments to the FAQ...I'll make a note to add something on this...

John

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks John.  I do keep looking before pestering you!  I've finished sorting it and ended up with a 150/50 combination which seems quite near the mark and I'll test it tomorrow.   Getting this sorted out has been both frustrating but also a learning curve so anything in FAQs would be great (for others now!)

I used the lines that I had before and it works but I am a bit puzzled because when I look at the numbers the decimal equivalent of 3FFF is 16383 but C001 is 49153 or have I got that totally wrong?  The ini file saves as I wanted it.

84=RC,5,Cx42000BC0,xC0010032     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=50, Limit=-16383)}-
85=RC,4,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF0032     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=50, Limit=16383)}-
86=RC,7,Cx42000BC0,xC0010096     -{offset sword decrement, offset 0BC0 (Decr=150, Limit=-16383)}-
87=RC,6,Cx32000BC0,x3FFF0096     -{offset sword increment, offset 0BC0 (Incr=150, Limit=16383)}-

As I said it works but I am just curious.

Roger

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay I won't.  It's easy to see why all this is overwhelming to most of us.  Anyway the method works and I can trim out very well now.  I'm using btns 4,5,6,7 on the honeycomb yoke so it's quite easy to flip from fast trim to slow as they are the rocker switches next to each other.

Thanks again John, have a good day.  No doubt will talk again!

Roger

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use. Guidelines Privacy Policy We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.