Bill Casey

I have now found that on the rare occasions that this uncontrollable deviation from path occurs that by dropping your next waypoint to the scratchpad then re-inserting as the next waypoint (then Execute) your a/c will recover and LNAV can be resumed. You have to be quick before the deviation has gone too far but it does work (for me anyway!).

Sir Peter - this may be a red herring but last week PMDG released a major update for the 747 and since then some users have been reporting some aircraft instability flying-wise. It may be coincidence but thus far those reporting problems are all Vista users (and most of their names begin with J fwiw). It might just be worth checking if you and this user are using the same 747 version and OS when testing this problem? While I'm here, since I'm running ASX SP3 and the latest 747 version I'll bung the latest FSUIPC on (I'm currently on 4.26) and see how things go pour moi.

Maybe I should change my Installer to check for FSCopilot, and put FSUIPC4 before it if it is there? Doing that would certainly make sure that people didn't suggest that FSUIPC had broken FSInn! It wouldn't solve everybody's dll.xml issues though since if they subsequently installed other add-ons then they'd still muck up the order of it anyway but at least they'd being addressing the issue to someone else! MS really did create a monster with dll.xml although I guess it's one that was difficult to foresee as becoming an issue until the various FSX add-ons hit the marketplace. Another "lesson learned" from FSX for when FS11 arrives one hopes!

It is indeed a strange one Sir Pete. Copilot likes to be the last entry then FSUIPC after things like PMDGs. Some people find Leveld below FSIUIPC works. On my system I find Copilot last then FSUIPC second last works best, after LevelD which is after PMDG. Some people find a different mix works BUT the common thread is always Copilot last.

Sorry, only just spotted this one! It's quite a simple fix. Firstly, in your DLL.XML file make sure that Copilot is the last entry. It must ALWAYS be the last entry so if you ever install/reinstall aything else in FSX you'll need to move it again. You can also achieve this by deinstalling and reinstalling FSInn/FSCopilot. Then open FSX, launch FSInn from your Windows START menu, the programme you want to run is FSInnUI. This will launch the FSInn Control Panel. Now click on the Chat button. It'll open fine. You only need to do it this way once and after that you can run FSInn as previously from you ADD ON drop-down menu in FSX. Pete - it's simply because the FSUIPC install pops it below Copilot as do all other add-ons. It's a quirk of FSInn/FSX not your installer. It's a PITA and the most FAQ'd "feature" of FSInn!

Pete Yes the advice with ASX is to load that first, let it do it's stuff downloading and setting itself up, and then launch FSX. I've always done it that way then, as I mentioned, things tend to be a bit more stable if one uses the "launch FSX" button inside ASX. Now this, to answer your quessie earlier, I do on the same PC. I have no idea if any of this applies with a remote PC because I've never run that setup. Jim S at ASX may be able to furnish you with the techie side of this when he's back from hols.

Yes, I made Jim aware of it a week or so ago but I mentioned it here just as piece of general info since everything seems more stable if FSX is launched from within ASX.

ASX SP3 Beta was released to the public last night, John might like to try that and see if it makes a difference. Note that the advice is to use wind smoothing in FSUIPC and not ASX if using both. One thing I have discovered in trying to recreate John's prob is that ASX is more prone to crash if launched outside of ASX rather than using the "launch FSX" button inside ASX, that might be worth trying although when I had those crashes it was xengine that crashed rather than FS itself.

FYI Peter - my testing was done with SP2 not Acceleration. I wasn't however running ASX on a remote machine.

Michael One thing you havn't mentioned is whether or not you have ASX Wind Smoothing option on or not. I achieved my best results with 4.241/ASX with ASX Wind Smoothing OFF. Which way do you have it set?

4.241 with LevelD 767X, all smoothing on, all turbulance suppressed, smoothing thread OFF. Using ASX (wind smoothing off). Flew Glasgow-Stansted in order to get a fair few changes of weather station on the way down and all in all a thoroughly pleasant flight with some nice slight bumpy stuff in the Lorel hold. Basically nothing to report :D Next time will be the 747X on the same flight, same settings and see if there's any difference between the two. Next time I'm passing Stoke I'm going to buy this Dowson geezer a jolly good lunch!

Well, since air compressibility comes into it I suspect sudden changes in pressure could also contribute. Did you have the pressure smoothing enabled too? Yessir, I've kept that on throughout my testing. The only difference this time was that it was my first test of your betas with ASX so that added another variable to the pot and to me it's a question of getting the two playing nicely (which they so very nearly are). Pressure didn't seem too variable but that's a factor that I wasn't looking for, I'll run the same exercise again later, increase the OAT smoothing and keep a closer eye on the pressures to see if I can spot a common factor. My 747X also has an OAT meter so I'll watch that more closely as well. It is only a minor wrinkle in my opinion and doesn't cause major issues for me but of course what to me isn't a big issue may easily be described by someone else as a "huge variation and significant surging"! I'll try and remember to turn off the smoothing thread this time as well.

FSUIPC's temp smoothing tries to control the OAT. The other factors involved in computing TAT might be the ones actually doing the jumping anout.How many degrees per second do you call a "significant chunk" by the way? I don't even pretend to understand the links between OAT and TAT but I do know the effect it has on Mach numbers and the autothrottles! In terms of "chunks" the TATs were shifting between -25C and -40C, smoothed to an extent (again, way better than previously) but sharp enough movements of +/- 5C at a time to cause Mach numbers to go from 0.82 to 0.86 in a couple of seconds thus causing a bit of surging/dropping of the engines. Not violent though, just enough to make me notice and I have a log of this phase of flight if it's any use. I do realise that you can only go so far on that aspect and quite honestly the effect is so much better than it was that I can quite easily live with it as it is now. On my next test with ASX I'll increase the OAT smoothing parameter a bit since I'm certain that that'll fix it.

OK, 4.241 is very good. One long 747x flight with the smoothing thread on (same other settings - all smoothing, turbulances off) and everything went fairly tickettyboo. I'll switch it off for tomorrow's flight but I'm very confident of excellent results. The only ripple this afternoon were slightly more excited TATs than of recent versions even with temp smoothing on, they were hopping up and down in fairly significant chunks but again nothing violent enough to cause a real problem. Smoothing thread off tomorrow and away we go :)

Hmm, curious, it does only say "partially installed" yet I'm delighted with the results. I get bigger and nastier wind changes with FS2002 than I'm getting with this! Still, no matter, I have another new version to assault this afternoon :twisted: .... that's if I don't watch the rugby and drink beer instead :D