Uncommanded AutoBrake

[Holclo]

Hi

Flying the PMDG737-800 I always get an uncommanded autobrake set as soon as the plane levels off.(I asume it is an autobrake set but there is no indication on the autobrake switch of any such setting) It does this under all situations VNAV,LVLChange.Handflying. The brakes stay on throughout the flight and can only be undone after the plane has come to a complete stop on the runway. I have included a small log. Would you translate this for me please. Does it help in showing what is happening. I am using CPFlight MCP , Saitek Throttle Quadrant and Logitech Joystick. It doesnt happen with default planes or LevelD. I have asked on the PMDG forum but no solution was found.

FSUIPC Key is provided

WIDEFS not user registered, or expired

Module base=61000000

ClassOptions: UIPCMAIN=FF7F, FS98MAIN=FF7F, FS2KMAIN=FF5E

WeatherOptions(Orig)=40003605[40003605]

InitDelay: 0 seconds

WeatherReadInterval=4

LogOptions=00000001

DebugStatus=15

11656 System time = 08:48:12

11671 C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\Flight Simulator 9\

11671 System time = 08:48:12, FS2004 time = 12:00:00 (00:00Z)

49062 C:\Documents and Settings\Billy\My Documents\Flight Simulator Files\Cardiff for Vatsim.flt

49218 AIRCRAFT\PMDG737-800\B737-800.air

54390 Aircraft="B737-800 Air Europa"

98515 C:\Documents and Settings\Billy\My Documents\Flight Simulator Files\UI generated flight.flt

100531 Clear All Weather requested: external weather discarded

115593 Advanced Weather Interface Enabled

183656 Traffic File #15 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic030528"

184656 C:\Program Files\FS2Phidget\FS2Phidget3414.exe

184890 C:\Program Files\CPFLIGHT\CPFlight Tools\FS_COM.EXE

186828 Traffic File #27 = "uk2000 scenery\uk2000 part 5\scenery\traffic_part5"

186890 Traffic File #26 = "uk2000 scenery\uk2000 part 2\scenery\traffic_part2"

189656 Traffic File #17 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_000_woa_air france by cityjet_su08_fs9"

190828 Traffic File #22 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_30_woa_ryanair_wi05"

190953 Traffic File #21 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_167_woa_bmibaby_su07"

191984 Traffic File #23 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_79_woa_easyjet_su07"

193218 Traffic File #19 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_000_woa_jet2_su08"

843062 WeatherOptions set, now 40003605 (timer=0)

1590281 Traffic File #20 = "scenery\world\scenery\traffic_00_woa_thomsonfly_su06"

1794765 HotKey entry at 3210, VK=255, Shifts=255, Flags=0, Result=0

1805125 HotKey entry at 3210, VK=255, Shifts=255, Flags=0, Result=0

1815484 HotKey entry at 3210, VK=255, Shifts=255, Flags=0, Result=0

[Log closed by user request, and continued in new file]

1825093 System time = 09:18:26, FS2004 time = 08:57:44 (08:57Z)

1825093 *** FSUIPC log file being closed

Memory managed: 124 Allocs, 17418 Freed

********* FSUIPC Log file closed ***********

Thanks

Bill

[Pete Dowson]

Flying the PMDG737-800 I always get an uncommanded autobrake set as soon as the plane levels off.(I asume it is an autobrake set but there is no indication on the autobrake switch of any such setting)

Autobrake set to what? How do you know if there's no indication -- in other words where IS the indication if it isn't on the autobrake switch?

It does this under all situations VNAV,LVLChange.Handflying. The brakes stay on throughout the flight and can only be undone after the plane has come to a complete stop on the runway.

And how are you undoing it if the autobrake switch is still in the Off position?

I have included a small log. Would you translate this for me please.

Translate into what lanbguage? Which bits don't you understand? there is nothing there about autobrakes -- why do you think there would be?

Does it help in showing what is happening.

No. You need first to go into FSUIPC's logging options and set the Event logging on -- it's one of the checkmarks on the left. In case it is a button or keypress, check the Buttons/Keys logging option too. Do not check or press anything else other than "Ok".

I am using CPFlight MCP , Saitek Throttle Quadrant and Logitech Joystick. It doesnt happen with default planes or LevelD.

It's unlikely to be a spurious button press then, though early versions of the Saitek throttle quadrant were known to create spurious button activity. So much so, in fact, that there's an FSUIPC option to try to remove them (it's the "EliminateTransients" parameter for the [buttons] section, as described in the FSUIPC Advanced user's guide).

BTW, why did you remove the initial lines from the Log, which show me the FSUIPC version you are using? Please don't do that. You'll need to tell me the version.

Regards

Pete

[Holclo]

(1) The big red "BRAKES" which appears at the bottom left of my screen gives me a little hint.

(2)Well when the plane comes to a complete stop on the runway without the use of Reverse Thrust, SpeedBrakes or Manual Brakes (by the way another indication to me that some sort of braking was in action) a little increase of the throttles gets the plane to taxi.

(3)Translate into English words you know like when = means "equals" in maths and + means "add"

(4) I have attached a Log file in zip fprmat. This represents a take off, circuit and landing. Hopefully it will show you what is happening.

(5) I remo9ved the top part as it was displaying my email address (even though that is now out of date) and I also wished to keep the log as small as possible.

Bill

FSUIPC.1.zip

[Pete Dowson]

(1) The big red "BRAKES" which appears at the bottom left of my screen gives me a little hint.

Ah, that is not "autobrakes". Autobrakes can be set to any value, and they don't illuminate that sign because autobrakes do not come on until the aircraft lands. I think you are a bit mixed up.

The "Brakes" sign means that the brakes command has been given -- either via both toe brakes being pressed at once (only one would give "differential brakes"), or via the single overall brakes command -- the same one operated by the "." keypress.

(2)Well when the plane comes to a complete stop on the runway without the use of Reverse Thrust, SpeedBrakes or Manual Brakes (by the way another indication to me that some sort of braking was in action) a little increase of the throttles gets the plane to taxi.

Manual braking is the exact thing which was occurring if the BRAKES sign was shown on the screen. Autobrakes do not illuminate that sign at all.

(3)Translate into English words you know like when = means "equals" in maths and + means "add"

So which words don't you know? They are pretty much either numbers or English -- not your natural language?

(4) I have attached a Log file in zip fprmat. This represents a take off, circuit and landing. Hopefully it will show you what is happening.

Okay.

First thing to note is that you are using an out-of-date unsupported version of FSUIPC. Please update before you come back for more help. Please review the Announcements in this Forum which tell you what versions are supported.

Second, just a simple search for the word "BRAKE" shows that there are no brake controls logged as being sent to FS during the portion of your session shown. There is also no sign of any obviously spurious buttons or keypresses in the portion shown. In fact the number of button presses (only 7!) for as complete a flight as you said is remarkably low -- evidently you either don't use them much or many are not assigned in FSUIPC.

Nevertheless, FS does see all the controls which are sent to FS, whether from your buttons or from other sources such as PMDG aircraft. There are quite a few of the latter by the look of it -- like this repeated cycle early on:

97250 *** EVENT: Cntrl= 66070 (0x00010216), Param= 0 (0x00000000) YAW_DAMPER_OFF

97250 *** EVENT: Cntrl= 66070 (0x00010216), Param= 0 (0x00000000) YAW_DAMPER_OFF

97250 *** EVENT: Cntrl= 65958 (0x000101a6), Param= 0 (0x00000000) FUEL_SELECTOR_RIGHT

97250 *** EVENT: Cntrl= 66330 (0x0001031a), Param= 0 (0x00000000) DEC_COWL_FLAPS1

However, none of them operate the brakes.

So, either the brake operation occurred before or after the portion of the session as logged (with the options needed selected), or it is somehow being applied directly, in a way not using any FS control.

Sorry, I'm no help with this. As it only happens with the PMDG aircraft i suspect it is only they who can help here. Maybe if you talked to them again, but without talking about "autobrakes" (which is an irrelevancy and probably took them on the wrong track), but instead merely talked about brakes being operated, they may understand better.

One question. when "BRAKES" was shown, did you try pressing the "." key to turn it off?

Another question: do you have rudders with toe brakes? Have you calibrated the toe brakes so that they are always off when untouched, even with pressure on the rudder?

Regards

Pete

[Holclo]

One question. when "BRAKES" was shown, did you try pressing the "." key to turn it off?

Another question: do you have rudders with toe brakes? Have you calibrated the toe brakes so that they are always off when untouched, even with pressure on the rudder?

(1) No I didn't as I thought this was only for "parking brake".

(2) Ah - now I used to have pedals and indeed the toe brakes worked perfectly. I have since sold these but didn't make any changes to any settings. Is that where the trouble could be?

[Pete Dowson]

(1) No I didn't as I thought this was only for "parking brake".

No, the '.' key momentarily presses the brakes. So pressing and releasing it presses and releases the brakes. It also releases the parking brake if that was set, mimicking what happens in a real aircraft. So if something has set the brakes on but not released them, pressing '.' would release them -- providing whatever was setting them wasn't doing it continuously.

(2) Ah - now I used to have pedals and indeed the toe brakes worked perfectly. I have since sold these but didn't make any changes to any settings. Is that where the trouble could be?

There's no sign of any toe brake or any brake activity at all in the log, so I shouldn't think so. Are you sure the brakes aren't on in the Flight you are loading, and you are just not releasing them? Try pressing ".".

Regards

Pete

[Holclo]

Pressing the "." key produces no response. Went into "assignments" and re allocated the "." key to Brakes - no change. I have been using a GoFlight T8 switch for parking brake release but no change even when I changed it to "brakes" via FSUIPC. Never worry I can live with it and thanks for your time and help. Have a look at my post (What do you want for Christmas) on mycockpit .org and you will understand me a little better!!

Bill

[Pete Dowson]

Pressing the "." key produces no response. Went into "assignments" and re allocated the "." key to Brakes - no change. I have been using a GoFlight T8 switch for parking brake release but no change even when I changed it to "brakes" via FSUIPC.

Something is holding the brakes on, then, and as it only happens with the one aircraft I'm afraid it is over to them (PMDG?).

If it was more general, i.e. all aircraft, I would, indeed, suspect some old assignment to your now not connected rudders -- especially if they were Game Port connected. If you have a game port driver still attempting to read a device no longer connected, it will return values which can do things like hold brakes on. Check the list of controllers assigned anyway, just in case.

Regards

Pete

[Holclo]

Pete

Just to make sure that anyone who does a search and finds this thread is not left without knowing what the solution was ..I have found it. Simple really in the end. The Flight which was causing the trouble was a PMDG-800 flight which had been saved as "default flight". Now I loaded the Cessna Default Flight (Iknow this has been recommended many times but we all do get lazy sometimes)and then changed the aircraft to the PMDG-800 and all was well. The Brakes problem has completely disappeared.

Bill

[Pete Dowson]

Pete

Just to make sure that anyone who does a search and finds this thread is not left without knowing what the solution was ..I have found it. Simple really in the end. The Flight which was causing the trouble was a PMDG-800 flight which had been saved as "default flight". Now I loaded the Cessna Default Flight (Iknow this has been recommended many times but we all do get lazy sometimes)and then changed the aircraft to the PMDG-800 and all was well. The Brakes problem has completely disappeared.

Good. Strange though.

Regards,

Pete

[Holclo]

And when I restarted my computer it went back to the old problem again. The search continues! :oops:

[Pete Dowson]

And when I restarted my computer it went back to the old problem again. The search continues! :oops:

Why not get it sorted, as you did once, then save that as your new startup flight?

Pete

[Holclo]

So after many flights and circuits It would appear that the only problem is with the PMDG- 800 (without winglets) The PMDG-800 aircraft with winglets does not have this problem and so the solution that I have chosen is simple. Fly the winglets version!

Bill