Parking Brake wont go off!

[calzoni92]

Have a issue with the latest FSUIPC version for FS9. (registered)

I have my brake Axis assigned via FSUIPC. Using the CH pedals. Left Brake and Right brake work independently and without issues. BUT when i go to the DIRECT calibration in FSUIPC, (I want to turn down the range of MIN and MAX values to get them to be less sensitive) the parking brake will no longer release. Regardless of aircraft.

Only solution is to reset (cancel) the DIRECT calibration but keep the separate left brake and right brake assignments in FSUIPC and the parking brake will release as normal again, but I am not able to achieve my goal of turning down the sensitivity. (because DIRECT calibration prevents the parking brake from working which is even worse of a problem)

Some advice would be great!

[Pete Dowson]

Have a issue with the latest FSUIPC version for FS9. (registered)

The term "latest" is meaningless. Please always state version numbers. I've had folks here saying "latest" meaning the latest they've seen someplace (often not even the official sources) -- one "latest" was over a year old and I spent a couple of days exchanging suggestions and reports before finally getting a log revealing the true version number!

I have my brake Axis assigned via FSUIPC. Using the CH pedals. Left Brake and Right brake work independently and without issues. BUT when i go to the DIRECT calibration in FSUIPC, (I want to turn down the range of MIN and MAX values to get them to be less sensitive) the parking brake will no longer release. Regardless of aircraft.

There's no relationship in FSUIPC between the toe brake operation and the parking brake. Do you mean you want/expect the parking brake to automatically release when you press the toes brakes? In a real aircraft you actually press the toe brakes and pull a lever which locks them in place. Releasing is the reverse. Is that what you mean?

Only solution is to reset (cancel) the DIRECT calibration but keep the separate left brake and right brake assignments in FSUIPC

The end result, in terms of controls sent to FS, should be the same wither way. The "direct" method merely avoids sending the controls to FS for them to be intercepted by FSUIPC immediately, for calibration.

[LATER]

Checking here, on FS9 is seems the Direct brake option uses direct control into FS's simulation engine, whereas the FS controls option still uses the FS controls. I think the difference you are noticing is that FS automatically disengages the parking brake when it sees brake control action, but the direct control bypasses that.

I've always used a parking brake lever in combination with the toe brakes, as described, but you've got used to just tapping the toe brakes I assume? I can deal with that I suspect. I'll think about it. Of course, you could too, using the right-hand-side of the Axis Assignments tab to send a parking brake off control when the toe brakes move "on" through any reasonably "pressed" range.

... but I am not able to achieve my goal of turning down the sensitivity.

Er, what sensitivity adjustments are these? FSUIPC doesn't offer any sensitivity adjustments. And all of the calibration adjustments are in the Joystick Calibration tab and apply exactly the same no matter how the controls arrive -- from FS, from FSUIPC via FS, or from FSUIPC directly.

Can you epxlain what you mean here, please, i.e. what "sensitivity" adjustment?

Pete

[Pete Dowson]

Checking here, on FS9 is seems the Direct brake option uses direct control into FS's simulation engine, whereas the FS controls option still uses the FS controls. I think the difference you are noticing is that FS automatically disengages the parking brake when it sees brake control action, but the direct control bypasses that.

I've been experimenting. Interestingly, on FSX is doesn't matter which way you assign the brake axes. Using axes for brakes rather then the "keep tapping" controls (like those assigned to '.' (both brakes), F11 and F12 (left and right toe brakes) simply does NOT auto-release the parking brakes.

Of course, when the parking brake is set, both left and right toe brake vsalues in FS are locked at maximum values. So, the brake axis controls have no effect. The provision in FS9 to auto-release on a brake axis control doesn't appear to carry over into FSX.

I'm reluctant to change FSUIPC to do auto-parking brake release, because there can be side effects for cockpit builders. Take my cockpit, for instance. In order to apply the parking brake I have to press both toe brakes good and hard, then pull the brake lever to lock them on. If I'm not careful, moving the toe brakes again (even possibly when releasing them) could take the parking brake off again.

Unlocking the parking brake is the reverse -- press hard on both toe brakes, then release the lever. I think on some aircraft the lever will drop to "off" in any case when there's enough foot pressure on the brakes, but this is a purely mechanical contrivance I think.

I will consider putting an option in (INI file only) to "release parking brake on toe brake action", but it will have ot default off. Meanwhile, I'd still like to know about this "sensitivity" adjustment of yours and why it is not possible using the FS control assignment.

If you wish to implement the parking-brake-off option via the right-hand side provisions in the Axis Assignments tab, and are not sure how to do it, let me know.

Regards

Pete

[calzoni92]

Hi Pete!

Thanks fr the insight so far!

FSUIPC 3.9.0.0

[JoystickCalibration]

AllowSuppressForPFCquad=Yes

ExcludeThrottleSet=Yes

ExcludeMixtureSet=Yes

ExcludePropPitchSet=Yes

SepRevsJetsOnly=No

ApplyHeloTrim=No

FlapsSetControl=0

FlapDetents=No

ReverserControl=66292

Reverser1Control=66422

Reverser2Control=66425

Reverser3Control=66428

Reverser4Control=66431

MaxThrottleForReverser=256

AileronTrimControl=0

RudderTrimControl=0

CowlFlaps1Control=0

CowlFlaps2Control=0

CowlFlaps3Control=0

CowlFlaps4Control=0

MaxSteerSpeed=60

Reverser=-16380,16380/6

Mixture=-16380,16380

Rudder=-16253,-520,512,16128

Throttle1=-13393,-512,512,16128/32

Throttle2=-13653,-512,512,16128/32

Throttle3=-13133,-512,512,16128/32

Throttle4=-13132,-512,512,16128/40

LeftBrake=-10142,15104

RightBrake=-10142,15104

As you will see i lowered the MIN and MAX values from the default -16386, and 16386 to -10142 and 15104. This is did under the (Direct!) Calibration window in FSUIPC.

My intention is so that if i tap th brake accidentally (these CH pedals are too sensitive! Just using the rudder sometimes will give one of the toe brakes a little input.) Which is why the above settings should get rid of this. But the result being that when i press my toe brake the parking brake wont go off. And actually on most aircraft you simply need to press the pedals furthers then at the position you locked them in by pulling the parking brake. But this is not what I am looking for!

The main issue is that when i land in lets say my PMDG or level D planes. Autobrake like in real life is triggered off by tapping the toe brakes. Something that will no longer happen when i change the values above. (just just 1 number from the default value, prevents parking brake release and thus autobrake release.)

And by sensitivity i just ment changing the ranges of MIN and MAX. If that makes sense as i described above.

If you wish to implement the parking-brake-off option via the right-hand side provisions in the Axis Assignments tab, and are not sure how to do it, let me know.

That would be great!

I actually tried this myself but the only actions with brakes i find in the drop down menu are brakes left, brakes right, brakes, and parking brake. Nothing mentioning parking brake release. So i definitely need some help with that! :P

[Pete Dowson]

FSUIPC 3.9.0.0

Oh dear. Please update. Version 3.93 is the earliest supported version. There's also a 3.942 version available in the Updates announcement.

As you will see i lowered the MIN and MAX values from the default -16386, and 16386 to -10142 and 15104. This is did under the (Direct!) Calibration window in FSUIPC.

There's no separate "direct" calibration window. There's one place for calibration and it works identically no matter how you assign the axes. You can change over to non-direct assignment and the exact same values will still be there and work as before.

The main issue is that when i land in lets say my PMDG or level D planes. Autobrake like in real life is triggered off by tapping the toe brakes. Something that will no longer happen when i change the values above.

Ah, autobrake is a totally different matter. By default FS9 does not switch off autobraking after landing, no matter what you do with the toe brakes. I use other software to provide that.

(just just 1 number from the default value, prevents parking brake release and thus autobrake release.)

Sorry, you've lost me there. I don't think parking brake release is relaed to autobrake at all. Can you explain?

And by sensitivity i just ment changing the ranges of MIN and MAX. If that makes sense as i described above.

Yes, but you could always set the MIN and MAX in the FSUIPC calibrations, no matter how you arrange the assignments. There's nothing different for any of the methods.

If you wish to implement the parking-brake-off option via the right-hand side provisions in the Axis Assignments tab, and are not sure how to do it, let me know.

That would be great!

I'm now not sure why you'd think that. Turning off the parking brake won't change anything to do with autobrakes. If that was your only concern, what's the point? And if you get what you want by assigning to the FS controls, Why not do that? Just calibrate your MIN and MAX as you want to. That's no different.

I actually tried this myself but the only actions with brakes i find in the drop down menu are brakes left, brakes right, brakes, and parking brake. Nothing mentioning parking brake release. So i definitely need some help with that! :P

From FS there's only the Parking Brake control, which is a toggle. But you can easily use Offset Word Set control. Set the Offset to x0BC8 (the Parking Brake offset) and the parameter to 0.

But please explain

(a) why you think you cannot calibrate in FSUIPC except by assigning Direct. That is worrying for me. The "direct" facility was added much much later than all the calibration facilities that folks have used for 10 years or so.

(b) why you think anything operating on Parking Brake will reset the Autobraking.

Thanks,

Pete

[calzoni92]

Thanks for all your help so far!!!

So now i have the latest FSUIPC release :P

To answer some of your questions:

I have Left break assigned to the left toe brake and right brake to the right toe brake. In this set up my parking brake goes off when i tap the brakes and autobrakes also go off when i tap my brakes. So thats fine.

But in this set up I often turn off my autobrake accidentally because when i am using the rudder on landing the toe brakes have some movement but it is enough to trigger the autobrake off just like it should on a real plane.

But it should not be that sensitive. And i want to have to press MORE toebrake to achieve the same default result. So the obvious solution is to go to 'joystick calibration' page 2 of 11 and Set Left brake Direct and Right brake direct. And then set the ranges to -15000 and 15000 or anything besides the default to get a bigger deadzone for the right brake and left brake BUT this will no longer remove the parking brake or disable my autobrakes when i now tap my toe brake.

So I hope this clears up what my intentions are. I want to decrease the negative -16380 default value to -15000 lets say for both left and right so that i have to actually press the toe brake to at least that value of -15000 to release the parking brake or autobrake. ( in order to remove accidental parking brake releases or autobrake releases when i move my rudder etc.) BUT I can no longer remove the parking brake or autobrake via the pedals as soon as i click the Set for left and right brake. And without clicking SET i cannot alter the value to a smaller range to give myself a bigger deadzone!!!!

Hope this helps you!

Regarding the Axis assignment "FSUIPC word offsett" i still cannot achieve a parking brake release when tapping my toe brake. And i dont understand how i can even keep the toebrake assigned when i change it from Send direct to FSUIPC calibration(left brake/right brake), to send to FSUIPC Offsett?

I believe there are two solutions to my problem: 1. "release parking brake on toe brake action" you mentioned above! I am more than happy to add this to my .INI

2. Get some insight on how i can alter the range of left brake and right brake without having to SET (direct) in the Joystick calibration.

I need the same parking brake off action when i tap my toe brakes but with a different range besides the default one of -16380, 16380! So that I have a bigger deadzone.

Thanks again!

And answering your question: Its not that i think i cant calibrate the range without assigning direct, its simply that i do not know how too or where to?!?!

Leo

[Pete Dowson]

I have Left break assigned to the left toe brake and right brake to the right toe brake. In this set up my parking brake goes off when i tap the brakes and autobrakes also go off when i tap my brakes.

The autobrake going off function is to do with the aircraft you are flying, is it?

But it should not be that sensitive. So the obvious solution is to go to 'joystick calibration' page 2 of 11 and Set Left brake Direct and Right brake direct. And then set the ranges to -15000 and 15000 for the right brake and left brake BUT this will no longer remove the parking brake or disable my autobrakes when i now tap my toe brake.

But you just implied you wanted it to!

As I tried to explain, obviously unsuccessfully, setting a smaller range for any axis is performed in the Joystick Calibration part of FSUIPC, and that part is the same no matter how you assign your axes! And setting greater of lesser "dead zones" (which is what you have done) is not what stops the parking brake or anything else coming off -- it is the fact that, in FS9, the brake axes when assigned normally do that but FSUIPC3 is not using them when you assign direct. (In FSX neither does what you want).

Really, by reducing the effective range on your brakes, you are actually making them more "sensitive", but with a wasted unused part at either end of the movement. If you really want less sensitivity you'd use the slopes facility to have a flatter slope near the "brakes off" position. Yes, still with a small dead zone to make sure they can always come off.

So I hope this clears up what my intentions are. I want to decrease the negative -16380 default value to -15000 lets say for both left and right so that i have to actually press the toe brake to at least that value of -15000 to release the parking brake or autobrake. ( in order to remove accidental parking brake releases or autobrake releases when i move my rudder etc.) So i can no longer remove the parking brake or autobrake via the pedals as soon as i click the Set for left and right brake. And without clicking SET i cannot alter the value to a smaller range giving me a bigger deadzone!!!!

You can do all of that whilst assigning the toe brakes in any way you like. Using the "direct to FSUIPC calibration" is no different for that at all. The Joystick Calibration section operates for the left and right brakes just the same -- and it does so even if you don't even use FSUIPC's axis assignments at all!

So, you are entirely missing the point. I'll repeat it again, shall I? You can assign toe brakes in FS9 or in FSUIPC. In FSUIPC you can assign them "direct to FSUIPC calibration" or you can assign them to the usual FS controls. So, that's three ways of assigning them. With me so far? Right.

Now, the crunch point. It doesn't matter which of the three ways you assign the brakes. You can still open the FSUIPC calibration tab, go to where the toe brakes part is, and calibrate them there. Yes, by pressing "Set" (if it isn't already pressed and showing "Reset").

That facility, the one for calibration, has been in FSUIPC for nearly 10 years. The facilities for assigning axes in FSUIPC is only half that age. The ways of assigning do not change the way you calibrate.

Hope this helps you!

Sorry, I thought it was you that needed help! ??

Regarding the Axis assignment "FSUIPC word offsett" i still cannot achieve a parking brake release when tapping my toe brake. And i dont understand how i can keep the toebrake assigned when i change it from Send direct to FSUIPC calibration to send to FSUIPC Offsett?

You didn't read that part of my message either? Do NOT assign to an offset control! The facility I was talking about is on the RIGHT-HAND SIDE of the Axis Assignments tab -- you are still looking at the LEFT! The right-hand side facilities allow you to associate any controls with movement of the axis through any one of up to 10 zones in either or both directions. Assignment there does not affect assignment on the left.

Anyway, the offset control I suggested would only release the parking brake, it would not affect the autobraking action. If merely blipping the normal brakes control ('.') does that, it will do both things, so it is probably better to use that -- it's the control called just "brakes".

However, I don't think you need to do any of that -- if you assigned to the FS controls for toe brakes and calibrated in FSUIPC as you wish, there wouldn't be a problem. You are only getting into a problem because you insist on using the "direct" assignment, but as I keep pointing out that is not necessary.

You mentioned a change in the .INI file that would release the parking brake when toe brakes are touched. Could i add this to mine somehow and let you know how it works out?

No, of course not. I haven't made any changes to FSUIPC yet. I said I would think about it, remember. It would mean a new version of FSUIPC, not just an INI change!

Regards

Pete

[calzoni92]

Hi again Pete!!!

Without getting myself even more confused, i will start from the beginning disregarding what i have done as it clearly is wrong!

I want to have two separate toe brakes. So my setup so far:

1. Under axis assignment: For Axis 3X (left toe brake i assigned: direct to FSUIPC calibration: Leftbrake)

2. Under axis assignment: For axis 3Y (right toe brake i assigned: direct to FSUIPC calibration: Rightbrake)

This gives me (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) which is fine . BUT I want to have to press the pedal further down to achieve the same: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off)

How can i achieve this in the best/simplest way that you would recommend? What steps should i take after step 2 (Clearly anything under the Joystick Calibration Tab and then pressing SET to get to the slope etc. prevents the: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) fro happening so I will no longer touch that.

Thanks for all your help so far Pete! I really really appreciate it.

(Something that you recommended but that did not work "Setting a Slope" In order to set a slope I have to press Set and when ever i press Set that alone removes the: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) function!

Leo :)

[Pete Dowson]

I want to have two separate toe brakes. So my setup so far:

1. Under axis assignment: For Axis 3X (left toe brake i assigned: direct to FSUIPC calibration: Leftbrake)

2. Under axis assignment: For axis 3Y (right toe brake i assigned: direct to FSUIPC calibration: Rightbrake)

This gives me (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) which is fine .

Erit does? I thought you said when assigning "direct" it doesn't do those two things. In fact I know it doesn't, because I tried it here. However, assigning to the FS controls, Axis left brake set and Axis right brake set, does.

BUT I want to have to press the pedal further down to achieve the same: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off)

You want to do this but still have the toe brakes operating BEFORE the point where the parking brake and autobrake cut out? I'm afraid that cannot be done at present, with or without FSUIPC. I will be considering adding such a facility, though (see my P.S.)

How can i achieve this in the best/simplest way that you would recommend? What steps should i take after step 2 (Clearly anything under the Joystick Calibration Tab and then pressing SET to get to the slope etc. prevents the: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) fro happening so I will no longer touch that.

Now this is where it gets completely daft. What on Earth do you mean by that? If you do not press SET and calibrate the brakes, there is no point whatsoever in using FSUIPC at all. And if you have your brakes assigned "direct" to FSUIPC calibration, then unless you calibrate they simply will not work!

(Something that you recommended but that did not work "Setting a Slope" In order to set a slope I have to press Set and when ever i press Set that alone removes the: (Parking brake off and Autobrake off) function!

If you don't press "SET" and calibrate the brakes you are not using FSUIPC. You might as well forget about FSUIPC for axes if you don't calibrate, as it cannot do anything for you.

I really don't understand how you have become so totally confused, and I really don't know how to explain any further. I've repeatedly explained that what you want to do can very easily be done by simply doing what you did already, but assign to the FS controls -- i.e. NOT assigning Direct. By assigning direct, in FSUIPC3, you are bypassing the FS controls, and it is those very FS controls which disengage the parking brake.

You can still set your null zone. That can be set no matter how you assign your controls. As I keep repeating. The calibration part can apply to any way of assignment.

I'm sorry, I do not have any more ways to say the same thing. You seem simply not to be reading me at all. :-(

Pete

P.S. I probably will add a new option to FSUIPC, to set a threshold for brake release operations, independently of calibration. This would be needed on FSX where none of the methods of assigning will do it at present. At least using FS9 you have a method -- simply assign to the FS controls in the drop down.

[calzoni92]

Hi again Pete.

Dont get me wrong, I have not been trying to tell you what to do, just trying to explain you my problem because nobody knows this better then you :P

You want to do this but still have the toe brakes operating BEFORE the point where the parking brake and autobrake cut out? I'm afraid that cannot be done at present, with or without FSUIPC. I will be considering adding such a facility, though (see my P.S.)

NO!

As an example lets say, DEFAULT IS I press my pedal a half inch down and it then releases the autobrake while applying the left/right brake. Depending on what toe pedal i am using of course. (so any form of brake pressure=parking brake release/autobrake disengage which is Great!)

What i am trying to achieve, is to have the same exact function but with having to press the pedal (lets say) 3 inches down! giving me more "dead zone" such as when using the rudder to prevent unintentional autobrake release on landing! or parking brake release at the gate. (autobrake again always released by the same 'brake' input that releases parking brake by default)

So this should clear up what i am trying to achieve!

I really don't understand how you have become so totally confused, and I really don't know how to explain any further. I've repeatedly explained that what you want to do can very easily be done by simply doing what you did already, but assign to the FS controls

So if I understand you correctly instead of setting "Direct to FSUIPC" in the first plane (under axis assignment) i should click "Send to FS as normal axis" and then assign Axis Brake left/ Axis brake right" AND THEN go to 'joystick calibration' Click SET and choose the range i want. So THIS will allow me to keep the (Parking brake off/autobrake disengage) function when i tap either of my toe brakes?

if the above which you have clearly described before but i have only understood now is correct then i think i have a solution to my problem!?

I hope i go this right now!

And again thanks so much for your effort in teaching a n00b how to use FSUIPC!

Leo :)

[Pete Dowson]

As an example lets say, DEFAULT IS I press my pedal a half inch down and it then releases the autobrake while applying the left/right brake. Depending on what toe pedal i am using of course. (so any form of brake pressure=parking brake release/autobrake disengage which is Great!)

Great? But surely wrong. However, that is what does appear to happen with the FS controls, so if you want that to occur, that is the way you should be assigning -- NOT to "direct".

What i am trying to achieve, is to have the same exact function but with having to press the pedal (lets say) 3 inches down! giving me more "dead zone" such as when using the rudder to prevent unintentional autobrake release on landing! or parking brake release at the gate. (autobrake again always released by the same 'brake' input that releases parking brake by default)

So, just do as I keep telling you. Assign to FS controls, not "direct", then set the null zone in the calibration section as you've been doing!

So if I understand you correctly instead of setting "Direct to FSUIPC" in the first plane (under axis assignment) i should click "Send to FS as normal axis" and then assign Axis Brake left/ Axis brake right" AND THEN go to 'joystick calibration' Click SET and choose the range i want. So THIS will allow me to keep the (Parking brake off/autobrake disengage) function when i tap either of my toe brakes?

Yes. Hurrah! (I've only said it about eight times! ;-) :roll: )

Regards

Pete

[calzoni92]

THANK YOU Pete!!

brgds,

leo

[Pete Dowson]

THANK YOU Pete!!

I have also now implemented a "brake release threshold" into FSUIPC.

There's a new parameter: BrakeReleaseThreshold=75 added to the [General] section of the FSUIPC INI file. This sets the amount of braking needed to release the parking brakes and autobrakes. The number is a percentage of total braking -- so the default here is 75%. If you set 0% it turns the facility off. Action on both brakes to more than the set level is required, and the release action is not "re-armed" until both brakes have returned to "off". The toe brakes must both be calibrated in FSUIPC.

This facility works in FSUIPC3 and FSUIPC4, and works with the "Direct to FSUIPC" assignment option. In FSX it works the same way with all assignment methods, but in FS9 it only works with Direct assignments because FS9 automatically disables the braking on any brake action, so the threshold, although applied, is meaningless with FS control assignments..

I think this will better meet the needs of the serious cockpit builders among us!

These facilities will be in the next incremental updates, 3.943 and 4.547, in the Updates & Goodies Announcement, either later today, or maybe tomorrow.

Regards

Pete

[calzoni92]

I have also now implemented a "brake release threshold" into FSUIPC.

There's a new parameter: BrakeReleaseThreshold=75 added to the [General] section of the FSUIPC INI file. This sets the amount of braking needed to release the parking brakes and autobrakes. The number is a percentage of total braking -- so the default here in 75%. If you set 0% it turns the facility off. Action on both brakes to more than the set level is required, and the release action is not "re-armed" until both brakes have returned to "off". The toe brakes must both be calibrated in FSUIPC.

This facility works in FSUIPC3 and FSUIPC4, and works with the "Direct to FSUIPC" assignment option. In FSX it works the same way with all assignment methods, but in FS9 it only works with Direct assihgnments because FS9 automatically disables the braking on any brake action, so the threshold, altough applied, is meaningless with FS control assignments..

I think this will better meet the needs of the serious cockpit builders among us!

These facilities will be in the next incremental updates, 3.943 and 4.547, in the Updates & Goodies Announcement, either later today, or maybe tomorrow.

Regards

Pete

I am very happy to hear this! thanks for all your effort and keep the amazing work up!

Cheers,

leo