Auto Throttle

[philldant]

I had to reconfigure my profile after getting a second quadrant. I must have done something different this time but can't seem to fix it. In the past when I had the auto throttle engaged I could move my throttle handles to match the N1 levels as set by th A/T. now if I move them the N1 drops as much as I move the throttles. In other words if the A/T is holding at 80% N1 with my levers at the top, if I try to pull back the throttles to match the 80% the N! drops as I move meaning the only time they would be equal is at idle. Ideas???

Thanks

[Pete Dowson]

I had to reconfigure my profile after getting a second quadrant. I must have done something different this time but can't seem to fix it. In the past when I had the auto throttle engaged I could move my throttle handles to match the N1 levels as set by th A/T. now if I move them the N1 drops as much as I move the throttles. In other words if the A/T is holding at 80% N1 with my levers at the top, if I try to pull back the throttles to match the 80% the N! drops as I move meaning the only time they would be equal is at idle. Ideas???

With default aircraft the throttles should be ignored when the A/T is engaged. What aircraft are you using? It will make a difference. Some use the same controls as your throttles to operate autothrottle, so you'd be interfering.

I assume posting here you imply you are using FSUIPC3 (FS9 or learlier?) or FSUIPC4 (FSX or P3D?), for calibration, or even assignment. But you give precious little information so I really don't know how to advise further.

Regards

Pete

[philldant]

With default aircraft the throttles should be ignored when the A/T is engaged. What aircraft are you using? It will make a difference. Some use the same controls as your throttles to operate autothrottle, so you'd be interfering.

I assume posting here you imply you are using FSUIPC3 (FS9 or learlier?) or FSUIPC4 (FSX or P3D?), for calibration, or even assignment. But you give precious little information so I really don't know how to advise further.

Regards

Pete

Sorry Pete, I am using the latest fsuipc with fsx and pmdg. I had everything configured for the 737ngx and the last time I logged in the profile was not working. Probably something I did but don't know what. Anyway I setup the profile again and that is wen I experienced the issue reported. I have the fsx controls disabled and use fsuipc to calibrate the Saitek Yoke, rudders and two quadrants. Sorry to be a pain...

[Pete Dowson]

I am using the latest fsuipc with fsx and pmdg. I had everything configured for the 737ngx and the last time I logged in the profile was not working. Probably something I did but don't know what. Anyway I setup the profile again and that is wen I experienced the issue reported. I have the fsx controls disabled and use fsuipc to calibrate the Saitek Yoke, rudders and two quadrants. Sorry to be a pain.

So, you must have the throttles assigned in FSUIPC, as well as calibrated? (You don't have to assign in FSUIPC in order to calibrate).

There are lots of threads about difficulties with throttle assignments to suit the PMDG 737NGX. Most seem to lie around having the assignments made to the THROTLESn SET controls instead of the normal FSX controls AXIS THROTTLEn SET controls. If you are wanting reverse zones on the axes there's no choice -- the AXIS_ controls don't offer reverse. Most folks seem to make it all work by setting the No Reverse Zone option on the 4 throttles page, and the "UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes" option in the INI. Then either put the reversers on the buttons which get pressed when pulling the throttle levers right back, or assigning separate reverser levers.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

I had the same issue a few months ago with the NGX not ignoring any movement of the Saitek throttle quadrant levers when Autothrottle was engaged. With Petes kind help I still couldnt get it to work correctly as I would have liked. Tried so many different options, having throttle assigned to axis in FSX or controllers disabled in FSX and assigned via FSUIPC. The ONLY way I could prevent the thrust changing in the NGX was to make sure the throttles were NOT calibrated in FSUIPC, not ideal but meant I could move the physical control lever to match the N1 display in the sim without any sudden change of power.

Chris Ibbotson

[Pete Dowson]

I had the same issue a few months ago with the NGX not ignoring any movement of the Saitek throttle quadrant levers when Autothrottle was engaged. With Petes kind help I still couldnt get it to work correctly as I would have liked. Tried so many different options, having throttle assigned to axis in FSX or controllers disabled in FSX and assigned via FSUIPC. The ONLY way I could prevent the thrust changing in the NGX was to make sure the throttles were NOT calibrated in FSUIPC, not ideal but meant I could move the physical control lever to match the N1 display in the sim without any sudden change of power.

Everyone else seemed to solve that as I described, by using the "UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes" option in the INI file and checking the "No Reverse Zone" option in FSUIPC's calibration page. That simply forces FSUIPC to use the exact same controls as FSX.

There is no reverse zone available in the regular FSX axis controls, which is why FSUIPC normally calibrates using the THROTTLESn_SET controls, which do have a reverse zone. There's no other way to get a reverse zone on an axis. Of course if you have enough throttle levers you can assign separate reversers, which gets over the problem -- otherwise reverse would have to be handled by button assignment.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

I never assign a reverse zone to the throttles as I use the button assignment which is activated on the Saitek Quad when you move the throttle to idle then push it down to engage the button. Ticking the NRZ and checking the ini file too failed to help, every time I tried to set calibration in FSUIPC the Autothrottle wouldn't work correctly. The thrust would change when you moved the lever and often disconnect. I would have liked 2 axis assigned for throttle 1 and 2 but this required the axis to have their calibration sync'd.

[Pete Dowson]

I never assign a reverse zone to the throttles as I use the button assignment which is activated on the Saitek Quad when you move the throttle to idle then push it down to engage the button. Ticking the NRZ and checking the ini file too failed to help, every time I tried to set calibration in FSUIPC the Autothrottle wouldn't work correctly. The thrust would change when you moved the lever and often disconnect.

Something was certainly set wrong, then, because if that INI file parameter is correct and the NRZ option selected, FSUIPC is sending the same controls, exactly, as assigning in FS itself would. I know a lot of NGX users are using FSUIPC fully without any problems at all.

I would have liked 2 axis assigned for throttle 1 and 2 but this required the axis to have their calibration sync'd.

Er, why does using two separate throttles need calibration syncing? I never have my two throttles synced. It is quite realistic for the actual positions to be slightly different. And if for some reason you do want them lined up perfectly you can do that easily enough using FSUIPC's sync pos facilities.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

I checked and doubled checked all the settings when we previously went through this, removed all assignments in FSX, uninstalled FSUIPC, reinstalled it and setup all axis and buttons again, setting two axis on the throttle quadrant to Throttle 1 and Throttle 2 and they would work fine in any aircraft, moving one lever increases the props or thrust on that particular engine. I appreciate there can be a bit of difference in the calibration but in the NGX I'm seeing between 5-10% of a difference when the levers are set physically side by side. I've tried differrent levers and I also have two quadrants so tried 2 levers assigned on the 2nd quadrant, also tried 1 lever on one and 1 on the other but the same issue happens. They've been unplugged and replugged, used different USB slots etc etc but the result is the exact same, perhaps faulty Saitek units I'm not sure, they are well outside their warranty though they matched % a lot closer in other aircraft. You have a function built into your module to allievate this sync issue which I have tried many times in the past. It created 2 major issues, the range of one of the throttles (throttle 2 I think) was reduced so moving the lever all the way to idle resulted in the throttle in the NGX only moving back to about 50-40% but the main problem was as previously mentioned, moving the throttle lever would cause the autothrottle to be overwriten and the thrust would change when it shouldnt, it would then disconnect the AT. The OP has the same issue as myself and no variant in configuring the controls would work, either assigned only in FSX or assigned in FSUIPC *IF* I enabled any form of throttle calibration in your module. I'll try it quickly again now as I've just downloaded 4.8 but if it doesnt work I'm just going to have to continue with using a single throttle axis

[Pete Dowson]

I checked and doubled checked all the settings when we previously went through this, removed all assignments in FSX, uninstalled FSUIPC, reinstalled it and setup all axis and buttons again, setting two axis on the throttle quadrant to Throttle 1 and Throttle 2 and they would work fine in any aircraft, moving one lever increases the props or thrust on that particular engine. I appreciate there can be a bit of difference in the calibration but in the NGX I'm seeing between 5-10% of a difference when the levers are set physically side by side.

The sync pos facilities in FSUIPC calibration could deal with such discrepancies easy enough. You can choose a number of positions to make the equate and FSUIPC will interpolate between. It effectively creates a specific curved calibration grapg instead of using the plain linear method.

You have a function built into your module to allievate this sync issue which I have tried many times in the past. It created 2 major issues, the range of one of the throttles (throttle 2 I think) was reduced so moving the lever all the way to idle resulted in the throttle in the NGX only moving back to about 50-40%

That doesn't sound anything like the sync pos facility. With the latter you simply create many positions which are to give equal input numbers and it fills in the parts between accordingly. You can certainly create enough positions to give very smooth reaults over the whole range. I don't know what you were using to make such a mess, but it wouldn't have been that.

... but the main problem was as previously mentioned, moving the throttle lever would cause the autothrottle to be overwriten and the thrust would change when it shouldnt, it would then disconnect the AT.

If using the same throttle controls as FSX assignment uses causes an autothrottle problem ,then there's certainly a bug or design deficiency in the aircraft modelling.

The OP has the same issue as myself and no variant in configuring the controls would work, either assigned only in FSX or assigned in FSUIPC *IF* I enabled any form of throttle calibration in your module. I'll try it quickly again now as I've just downloaded 4.8 but if it doesnt work I'm just going to have to continue with using a single throttle axis

You've confused me now. How does using a single throttle axis solve anything, apart perhaps from your sunc?

Pete

[dts]

I have just set up my saitek throttle quad, flying the PMDG NGX i had the problem where unless i fully opened the throttle after hitting toga then i would get an in balance in the engines on takeoff.

I have calibrated 2 seperate axis for each engine, with no reverse zone and also adjusted the ini file with "UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes" and now have no issue with the throttles. I also have a seperate axis for reverser set up.

This problem has been bugging me litterally since the NGX came out, this post has sorted this problem out.

[Pete Dowson]

I have calibrated 2 seperate axis for each engine, with no reverse zone and also adjusted the ini file with "UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes" and now have no issue with the throttles. I also have a seperate axis for reverser set up.

Yes, this is a good solution and many others use it

This problem has been bugging me litterally since the NGX came out, this post has sorted this problem out.

Good.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

The sync pos facilities in FSUIPC calibration could deal with such discrepancies easy enough. You can choose a number of positions to make the equate and FSUIPC will interpolate between. It effectively creates a specific curved calibration grapg instead of using the plain linear method.

That doesn't sound anything like the sync pos facility. With the latter you simply create many positions which are to give equal input numbers and it fills in the parts between accordingly. You can certainly create enough positions to give very smooth reaults over the whole range. I don't know what you were using to make such a mess, but it wouldn't have been that.

Apologies Pete my posts are made from work and I don't have access to FSX but what you describe above is what I'm using to sync the engines, I had in the past set perhaps a minimum of 5 positions from idle to full throttle, advancing both axis to the same position and pressing the sync button. I am not using any other utility for the controls, either to assign them or control any form of calibration. The autothrottle issue ONLY rears its ugly head once I set calibration for the throttles, either on page one of the calibration page if a single throttle axis is used or on the other page which has multi engine calibration.

If using the same throttle controls as FSX assignment uses causes an autothrottle problem ,then there's certainly a bug or design deficiency in the aircraft modelling.

As my original posts mentioned a few months ago it didn't matter if I assigned by throttle axis via FSX or via FSUIPC the problem came up if any of the throttles were calibrated within FSUIPC. Perhaps there is a bug with PMDG as I think they do say not to use any form of calibration. There is also an issue which causes their main PMDG_737NGX.dll to crash, many users, including myself could only resolve this crash if they set all their controls via FSUIPC and disabled the controllers in FSX.

You've confused me now. How does using a single throttle axis solve anything, apart perhaps from your sunc?

If I have a single axis then they don't need sync'd so I dont use FSUIPC's calibration, as soon as I turn on calibration for one, two axis etc the AT fails to work as it should.

I'm not at home until tomorrow evening but have in the past followed your advice and DTS's comments above "I have calibrated 2 separate axis, one for each engine, with no reverse zone and also adjusted the ini file with 'UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes' and it still didnt work. I'll treble check it tomorrow and if the problem persists I will just have to live with it.

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Sorry my last post didn't post properly with your quotes highlighted separately so hope you can work out my replies

Chris Ibbotson

[Pete Dowson]

... what you describe above is what I'm using to sync the engines, I had in the past set perhaps a minimum of 5 positions from idle to full throttle, advancing both axis to the same position and pressing the sync button.

In that case I don't understand how you got this result: "the range of one of the throttles (throttle 2 I think) was reduced so moving the lever all the way to idle resulted in the throttle in the NGX only moving back to about 50-40%". That makes no sense when all the sync pos does is match positions, equating different input values for the two axes to the same output values, then calibrating between.

If that simple mechanism is going wrong I need to know, so you shouldn't really keep it a secret. Please show me the resulting calibration sections from the INI, and if possible do a bit of logging -- log Axis events whilst moving the levers, together, slowly from full back to full forward.

The autothrottle issue ONLY rears its ugly head once I set calibration for the throttles, either on page one of the calibration page if a single throttle axis is used or on the other page which has multi engine calibration.

Odd that no one else gets such a problem. And especially with the page 1 single throttle, which doesn't change the FS control used at all even if you don't change thje INI setting. That's just a straight-forward adjustment ofg the axis values as they pass through FSUIPC.

As my original posts mentioned a few months ago it didn't matter if I assigned by throttle axis via FSX or via FSUIPC the problem came up if any of the throttles were calibrated within FSUIPC.

I understood you said that all along. Not sure why you are repeating it here. I simply do not understand why your setyup uniquely has an autothrottle cutout problem with FSUIPC using standard FSX controls when no one else seems to.

Perhaps there is a bug with PMDG as I think they do say not to use any form of calibration.

But all calibration is doing is massaging the axis values en route. It isn't changing anything else.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Hi Pete, I apologise for repeating things, I guess I'm just a little frustrated that your good advice, in my case, doesn't appear to be working. The issue I described with throttle 2 not going back to idle was something I experienced a few months ago quite a few times despite recalibrating and trying the sync options. I'll backup my modules folder and reinstall a fresh copy of FSUIPC, will set just the 2 throttle axis and test it in the NGX. Do I need to enable logging in FSUIPC? I'll get back to you later as I appreciate it not making sense when it works for others who have experienced the same thing but got your fix to work. Ps your work on the G3D.dll was a God send and I've not had a CTD with that dll since so thanks Pete

Chris Ibbotson

[Pete Dowson]

I'll backup my modules folder and reinstall a fresh copy of FSUIPC

All your settings are in the INI file. Reinstalling FSUIPC won't do anything, unless you take the opportunity to update. If you want to start afresh with settings, just rename the INI file.

Do I need to enable logging in FSUIPC?

Well we can do some logging but just logging everything without knowing precisely what we are doing will just generate heaps of data with no way of analysing it. I need to know more about what the problem really is first, and that includes showing the INI file section with the sync pos settings which you said didn't work and stopped one axis going to idle (as I asked earlier).

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Ok here's a few ini files in various states of setup

1. axis set up for aileron, elevator, rudder, spoiler, flaps and throttle1 and throttle 2 (all assigned via FSUIPC with FSX controllers disabled - throttles left uncalibrated - result is NGX autothrottle system works as it should, in cruise with MCP Speed moving the Saitek throttles just shows a blue arc on the N1 but the throttles remain set

[General]

UpdatedByVersion=4800

History=3VQ6IHTWU1066YCW6PI3O

MouseWheelTrim=No

MouseWheelTrimSpeed=1

JoystickTimeout=20

PollGFTQ6=Yes

BlankDisplays=No

FixControlAccel=No

FixMachSpeedBug=No

DeleteVehiclesForAES=Yes

VisibilityOptions=No

OneCloudLayer=No

CloudTurbulence=No

CloudIcing=No

GenerateCirrus=No

SuppressCloudTurbulence=No

MaxIce=-4

MinIce=-4

UpperWindGusts=No

SuppressWindTurbulence=No

SuppressWindVariance=No

WindTurbulence=No

TurbulenceRate=1.0,5.0

TurbulenceDivisor=20,20,40,40

SuppressAllGusts=No

MaxSurfaceWind=0

WindLimitLevel=200

WindDiscardLevel=400

WindAjustAltitude=No

WindAjustAltitudeBy=2000

SmoothBySimTime=No

WindSmoothing=No

WindSmoothness=2

WindSmoothAirborneOnly=Yes

PressureSmoothness=0

TemperatureSmoothness=0

DisconnTrimForAP=No

ZeroElevForAPAlt=No

ThrottleSyncAll=No

WhiteMessages=No

ShowPMcontrols=No

SpoilerIncrement=512

MagicBattery=No

RudderSpikeRemoval=No

ElevatorSpikeRemoval=No

AileronSpikeRemoval=No

ReversedElevatorTrim=No

ClockSync=No

ClockSyncMins=5

ClearWeatherDynamics=No

OwnWeatherChanges=No

TimeForSelect=4

LoadFlightMenu=No

LoadPlanMenu=No

PauseAfterCrash=No

BrakeReleaseThreshold=75

SaveDataWithFlights=No

ZapSound=firework

ShortAircraftNameOk=No

UseProfiles=Yes

EnableMouseLook=No

AxesWrongRange=No

TCASid=Flight

TCASrange=40

AxisCalibration=No

DirectAxesToCalibs=No

ShowMultilineWindow=Yes

SuppressSingleline=No

SuppressMultilineFS=No

AxisIntercepts=No

DontResetAxes=No

InitDelay=0

GetNearestAirports=Yes

WeatherReadFactor=2

WeatherRewriteSeconds=1

CustomWeatherModify=No

SimConnectStallTime=1

LuaRerunDelay=66

Console=No

FSVersionUsed="Microsoft Flight Simulator X",10.0.61472.0

SimConnectUsed=10.0.61259.0

[JoyNames]

AutoAssignLetters=No

0=Logitech Formula Force EX USB

0.GUID={F421FC40-1933-11E1-8002-444553540000}

1=Saitek Pro Flight Throttle Quadrant

1.GUID={3E7194E0-5430-11E1-8002-444553540000}

2=Saitek Pro Flight Yoke

2.GUID={3E926350-5430-11E1-8003-444553540000}

[buttons]

ButtonRepeat=20,10

[AutoSave]

Next=1

Interval=60

Files=10

SaveOnGround=No

AutoSaveEnabled=No

[GPSout]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[GPSout2]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[WideServer]

WideFSenabled=Yes

[sounds]

Path=D:\Microsoft Flight Simulator X\Sound\

Device1=Primary Sound Driver

Device2=Speakers (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device3=Digital Output (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device4=Speakers (Apowersoft_AudioDevice)

Device5=SPDIF Interface (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

[Axes]

0=0S,256,D,3,0,0,0

1=1X,256,D,22,0,0,0

2=1Y,256,D,9,0,0,0

3=1Z,256,D,10,0,0,0

4=2X,256,D,1,0,0,0

5=2Y,256,D,2,0,0,0

6=2U,256,D,23,0,0,0

[JoystickCalibration]

AllowSuppressForPFCquad=Yes

ExcludeThrottleSet=Yes

ExcludeMixtureSet=Yes

ExcludePropPitchSet=Yes

SepRevsJetsOnly=No

ApplyHeloTrim=No

UseAxisControlsForNRZ=No

FlapsSetControl=0

FlapDetents=No

ReverserControl=66292

Reverser1Control=66422

Reverser2Control=66425

Reverser3Control=66428

Reverser4Control=66431

MaxThrottleForReverser=256

AileronTrimControl=66731

RudderTrimControl=66732

CowlFlaps1Control=66162

CowlFlaps2Control=66163

CowlFlaps3Control=66164

CowlFlaps4Control=66165

SteeringTillerControl=0

MaxSteerSpeed=60

Aileron=-16384,0,0,16383

Elevator=-16384,0,0,16320

Rudder=-16380,-512,512,16380/16

Spoilers=-16256,16253/16

Flaps=-16384,16383/16

2. As above - throttles 1 and 2 on 4 throttle page now calibrated - result is NGX autothrottle system fails, in cruise with MCP Speed moving the Saitek throttles just shows a white arc on the N1 and throttles increase or reduce according to the movement of the levers then return to their autothrottle percent, if I move a single lever the AT disconnects, this is even when setting NEVER in PMDGs options for Autothrottle Manual Override. Ive also ticked in FSUIPC the No Reverse Zone though I think I manually had to change UseAxisControlsForNRZ= to Yes

[General]

UpdatedByVersion=4800

History=3VQ6IHTWU1066YCW6PI3O

MouseWheelTrim=No

MouseWheelTrimSpeed=1

JoystickTimeout=20

PollGFTQ6=Yes

BlankDisplays=No

FixControlAccel=No

FixMachSpeedBug=No

DeleteVehiclesForAES=Yes

VisibilityOptions=No

OneCloudLayer=No

CloudTurbulence=No

CloudIcing=No

GenerateCirrus=No

SuppressCloudTurbulence=No

MaxIce=-4

MinIce=-4

UpperWindGusts=No

SuppressWindTurbulence=No

SuppressWindVariance=No

WindTurbulence=No

TurbulenceRate=1.0,5.0

TurbulenceDivisor=20,20,40,40

SuppressAllGusts=No

MaxSurfaceWind=0

WindLimitLevel=200

WindDiscardLevel=400

WindAjustAltitude=No

WindAjustAltitudeBy=2000

SmoothBySimTime=No

WindSmoothing=No

WindSmoothness=2

WindSmoothAirborneOnly=Yes

PressureSmoothness=0

TemperatureSmoothness=0

DisconnTrimForAP=No

ZeroElevForAPAlt=No

ThrottleSyncAll=No

WhiteMessages=No

ShowPMcontrols=No

SpoilerIncrement=512

MagicBattery=No

RudderSpikeRemoval=No

ElevatorSpikeRemoval=No

AileronSpikeRemoval=No

ReversedElevatorTrim=No

ClockSync=No

ClockSyncMins=5

ClearWeatherDynamics=No

OwnWeatherChanges=No

TimeForSelect=4

LoadFlightMenu=No

LoadPlanMenu=No

PauseAfterCrash=No

BrakeReleaseThreshold=75

SaveDataWithFlights=No

ZapSound=firework

ShortAircraftNameOk=No

UseProfiles=Yes

EnableMouseLook=No

AxesWrongRange=No

TCASid=Flight

TCASrange=40

AxisCalibration=No

DirectAxesToCalibs=No

ShowMultilineWindow=Yes

SuppressSingleline=No

SuppressMultilineFS=No

AxisIntercepts=No

DontResetAxes=No

InitDelay=0

GetNearestAirports=Yes

WeatherReadFactor=2

WeatherRewriteSeconds=1

CustomWeatherModify=No

SimConnectStallTime=1

LuaRerunDelay=66

Console=No

FSVersionUsed="Microsoft Flight Simulator X",10.0.61472.0

SimConnectUsed=10.0.61259.0

[JoyNames]

AutoAssignLetters=No

0=Logitech Formula Force EX USB

0.GUID={F421FC40-1933-11E1-8002-444553540000}

1=Saitek Pro Flight Throttle Quadrant

1.GUID={3E7194E0-5430-11E1-8002-444553540000}

2=Saitek Pro Flight Yoke

2.GUID={3E926350-5430-11E1-8003-444553540000}

[buttons]

ButtonRepeat=20,10

[AutoSave]

Next=1

Interval=60

Files=10

SaveOnGround=No

AutoSaveEnabled=No

[GPSout]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[GPSout2]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[WideServer]

WideFSenabled=Yes

[sounds]

Path=D:\Microsoft Flight Simulator X\Sound\

Device1=Primary Sound Driver

Device2=Speakers (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device3=Digital Output (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device4=Speakers (Apowersoft_AudioDevice)

Device5=SPDIF Interface (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

[Axes]

0=0S,256,D,3,0,0,0

1=1X,256,D,22,0,0,0

2=1Y,256,D,9,0,0,0

3=1Z,256,D,10,0,0,0

4=2X,256,D,1,0,0,0

5=2Y,256,D,2,0,0,0

6=2U,256,D,23,0,0,0

[JoystickCalibration]

AllowSuppressForPFCquad=Yes

ExcludeThrottleSet=Yes

ExcludeMixtureSet=Yes

ExcludePropPitchSet=Yes

SepRevsJetsOnly=No

ApplyHeloTrim=No

UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes

FlapsSetControl=0

FlapDetents=No

ReverserControl=66292

Reverser1Control=66422

Reverser2Control=66425

Reverser3Control=66428

Reverser4Control=66431

MaxThrottleForReverser=256

AileronTrimControl=66731

RudderTrimControl=66732

CowlFlaps1Control=66162

CowlFlaps2Control=66163

CowlFlaps3Control=66164

CowlFlaps4Control=66165

SteeringTillerControl=0

MaxSteerSpeed=60

Aileron=-16384,0,0,16383

Elevator=-16384,0,0,16320

Rudder=-16380,-512,512,16380/16

Spoilers=-16256,16253/16

Flaps=-16384,16383/16

Throttle1=-16384,-512,512,16383/32

Throttle2=-16384,-512,512,16128/32

3. Finally with throttles 1 and 2 calibrated and sync'd with about 5 positions, moving both levers at the same time a fraction of their full range, letting go of them and pressing the Sync button. I think I manually had to change UseAxisControlsForNRZ= to Yes. The Autothrottle now works almost as it should but throttle2 will only return to 50% when I move the Saitek lever to idle, its like that axis still thinks theres a reverse zone!!

I hope this info helps Pete

Chris Ibbotson

[General]

UpdatedByVersion=4800

History=1JG795HMVPKSWO2MWF8TA

MouseWheelTrim=No

MouseWheelTrimSpeed=1

JoystickTimeout=20

PollGFTQ6=Yes

BlankDisplays=No

FixControlAccel=No

FixMachSpeedBug=No

DeleteVehiclesForAES=Yes

VisibilityOptions=No

OneCloudLayer=No

CloudTurbulence=No

CloudIcing=No

GenerateCirrus=No

SuppressCloudTurbulence=No

MaxIce=-4

MinIce=-4

UpperWindGusts=No

SuppressWindTurbulence=No

SuppressWindVariance=No

WindTurbulence=No

TurbulenceRate=1.0,5.0

TurbulenceDivisor=20,20,40,40

SuppressAllGusts=No

MaxSurfaceWind=0

WindLimitLevel=200

WindDiscardLevel=400

WindAjustAltitude=No

WindAjustAltitudeBy=2000

SmoothBySimTime=No

WindSmoothing=No

WindSmoothness=2

WindSmoothAirborneOnly=Yes

PressureSmoothness=0

TemperatureSmoothness=0

DisconnTrimForAP=No

ZeroElevForAPAlt=No

ThrottleSyncAll=No

WhiteMessages=No

ShowPMcontrols=No

SpoilerIncrement=512

MagicBattery=No

RudderSpikeRemoval=No

ElevatorSpikeRemoval=No

AileronSpikeRemoval=No

ReversedElevatorTrim=No

ClockSync=No

ClockSyncMins=5

ClearWeatherDynamics=No

OwnWeatherChanges=No

TimeForSelect=4

LoadFlightMenu=No

LoadPlanMenu=No

PauseAfterCrash=No

BrakeReleaseThreshold=75

SaveDataWithFlights=No

ZapSound=firework

ShortAircraftNameOk=No

UseProfiles=Yes

EnableMouseLook=No

AxesWrongRange=No

TCASid=Flight

TCASrange=40

AxisCalibration=No

DirectAxesToCalibs=No

ShowMultilineWindow=Yes

SuppressSingleline=No

SuppressMultilineFS=No

AxisIntercepts=No

DontResetAxes=No

InitDelay=0

GetNearestAirports=Yes

WeatherReadFactor=2

WeatherRewriteSeconds=1

CustomWeatherModify=No

SimConnectStallTime=1

LuaRerunDelay=66

Console=No

FSVersionUsed="Microsoft Flight Simulator X",10.0.61472.0

SimConnectUsed=10.0.61259.0

[JoyNames]

AutoAssignLetters=No

0=Logitech Formula Force EX USB

0.GUID={F421FC40-1933-11E1-8002-444553540000}

1=Saitek Pro Flight Throttle Quadrant

1.GUID={3E7194E0-5430-11E1-8002-444553540000}

2=Saitek Pro Flight Yoke

2.GUID={3E926350-5430-11E1-8003-444553540000}

[buttons]

ButtonRepeat=20,10

[AutoSave]

Next=1

Interval=60

Files=10

SaveOnGround=No

AutoSaveEnabled=No

[GPSout]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[GPSout2]

GPSoutEnabled=No

[WideServer]

WideFSenabled=Yes

[sounds]

Path=D:\Microsoft Flight Simulator X\Sound\

Device1=Primary Sound Driver

Device2=Speakers (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device3=Digital Output (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device4=Speakers (Apowersoft_AudioDevice)

Device5=SPDIF Interface (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

[Axes]

0=0S,256,D,3,0,0,0

1=1X,256,D,22,0,0,0

2=1Y,256,D,9,0,0,0

3=1Z,256,D,10,0,0,0

4=2X,256,D,1,0,0,0

5=2Y,256,D,2,0,0,0

6=2U,256,D,23,0,0,0

[JoystickCalibration]

AllowSuppressForPFCquad=Yes

ExcludeThrottleSet=Yes

ExcludeMixtureSet=Yes

ExcludePropPitchSet=Yes

SepRevsJetsOnly=No

ApplyHeloTrim=No

UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes

FlapsSetControl=0

FlapDetents=No

ReverserControl=66292

Reverser1Control=66422

Reverser2Control=66425

Reverser3Control=66428

Reverser4Control=66431

MaxThrottleForReverser=256

AileronTrimControl=66731

RudderTrimControl=66732

CowlFlaps1Control=66162

CowlFlaps2Control=66163

CowlFlaps3Control=66164

CowlFlaps4Control=66165

SteeringTillerControl=0

MaxSteerSpeed=60

Aileron=-16384,0,0,16383

Elevator=-16384,0,0,16320

Rudder=-16380,-512,512,16380/16

Spoilers=-16256,16253/16

Flaps=-16384,16383/16

Throttle1=-16384,-512,512,16383/32

Throttle2=-16384,-512,512,16128/32

SyncSlopeThrottle2=26/26,37/32,53/48,68/65,92/91,109/110,127/128

[cjibbotson]

Meant to add Pete when No Reverse Zone is ticked I get the following

Throttle 1

(Idle) In -16253 Out -16252 (Max) In 16383 Out 16384

Throttle 2

(Idle) In -16384 Out -4096****** (Max) In 16256 Out 16224

I think the -4096 is the culprit to throttle 2 only returning to 50% on manual thrust despite the lever being returned to idle

[Pete Dowson]

I think I manually had to change UseAxisControlsForNRZ= to Yes

I don't think it is there normally, so you would have had to add it.

Instead of assigning the throttles "direct to FSUIPC calibration", please assign them to the FS controls, "axis throttle1 set" and "axis throttle2 set". The 'direct to calibration' method bypasses FS and I think the PMDG needs to see them. I hadn't realised you were doing that.

Meant to add Pete when No Reverse Zone is ticked I get the following

Throttle 1

(Idle) In -16253 Out -16252 (Max) In 16383 Out 16384

Throttle 2

(Idle) In -16384 Out -4096****** (Max) In 16256 Out 16224

Is that with the "sync pos" method of calibration, because you only mentioned 40-50% business in that context I think?

I'll check the numbers here in any case.

Regards

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Good morning Pete, thanks for your help in this. I did try assigning them late last night as suggested, still through FSUIPC but not using the direct to FSUIPC calibration but rather the middle radio button option, I think I had to untick the Ignore throttle set or something in the 4 throttle calibration page. Apologies I'm in work again so not sure of the exact wording in your module, this gave me the same results. I'd rather not assign any controls within FSX itself as PMDG_737NGX.dll would often crash to desktop as if there's a minor conflict, disabling FSX Controllers or FSUIPC stops these crashes. I've read others having similar issues with both Saitek or CH Products with the NGX.

I've got it working fine now using 2 throttle axis as long as I do NOT sync them as the autothrottle doesnt work correctly and in manual throttle nr 2 stops at 50% and wont go to idle. Heres my latest ini without sync. Yes my previous post refered to sync pos, you can see in the ini above both axis seem to pretty much match through their range, they just go weird with the NGX. Just for the record I'm using Saitek Pro Flight yoke with 2 throttle quadrants and I've also utilised the pedals off a Logitech steering wheel which work well as rudder pedals.

[General]

UpdatedByVersion=4800

History=CO5X8EQBLYY7HJ1HKMG1F

MouseWheelTrim=No

MouseWheelTrimSpeed=1

JoystickTimeout=20

PollGFTQ6=Yes

BlankDisplays=No

FixControlAccel=Yes

FixMachSpeedBug=No

VisibilityOptions=No

OneCloudLayer=No

CloudTurbulence=No

CloudIcing=No

GenerateCirrus=No

SuppressCloudTurbulence=No

MaxIce=-4

MinIce=-4

UpperWindGusts=No

SuppressWindTurbulence=No

SuppressWindVariance=No

WindTurbulence=No

TurbulenceRate=1.0,5.0

TurbulenceDivisor=20,20,40,40

SuppressAllGusts=No

MaxSurfaceWind=0

WindLimitLevel=200

WindDiscardLevel=400

WindAjustAltitude=No

WindAjustAltitudeBy=2000

SmoothBySimTime=No

WindSmoothing=No

WindSmoothness=2

WindSmoothAirborneOnly=Yes

PressureSmoothness=0

TemperatureSmoothness=0

DisconnTrimForAP=No

ZeroElevForAPAlt=No

ThrottleSyncAll=No

WhiteMessages=No

ShowPMcontrols=No

SpoilerIncrement=512

MagicBattery=No

RudderSpikeRemoval=No

ElevatorSpikeRemoval=No

AileronSpikeRemoval=No

ReversedElevatorTrim=No

ClockSync=Yes

ClockSyncMins=5

ClearWeatherDynamics=No

OwnWeatherChanges=No

TimeForSelect=4

LoadFlightMenu=No

LoadPlanMenu=No

PauseAfterCrash=No

BrakeReleaseThreshold=75

SaveDataWithFlights=No

ZapSound=firework

ShortAircraftNameOk=No

UseProfiles=Yes

EnableMouseLook=No

AxesWrongRange=No

TCASid=Flight

TCASrange=40

AxisCalibration=No

DirectAxesToCalibs=No

ShowMultilineWindow=Yes

SuppressSingleline=No

SuppressMultilineFS=No

AxisIntercepts=No

DontResetAxes=No

InitDelay=0

GetNearestAirports=Yes

WeatherReadFactor=2

WeatherRewriteSeconds=1

CustomWeatherModify=No

SimConnectStallTime=1

LuaRerunDelay=66

Console=No

DeleteVehiclesForAES=Yes

FSVersionUsed="Microsoft Flight Simulator X",10.0.61472.0

SimConnectUsed=10.0.61259.0

[JoyNames]

AutoAssignLetters=No

0=Logitech Formula Force EX USB

0.GUID={F421FC40-1933-11E1-8002-444553540000}

1=Saitek Pro Flight Throttle Quadrant

1.GUID={3E7194E0-5430-11E1-8002-444553540000}

2=Saitek Pro Flight Yoke

2.GUID={3E926350-5430-11E1-8003-444553540000}

[buttons]

ButtonRepeat=20,10

2=P1,3,K50,10

3=P1,2,K49,10

4=P1,4,K51,10

5=P1,5,K52,10

6=R2,14,K53,10

7=R2,15,K54,10

8=R2,16,K55,10

9=R2,17,K56,10

10=R2,18,K57,10

11=R2,19,K48,10

12=R1,7,C65966,0

13=R1,8,C65971,0

14=R2,0,K190,8

15=R2,2,C65607,0

17=P1,0,K190,10

18=R2,3,C65615,0

19=R2,32,C65734,0

20=R2,36,C65735,0

21=R2,38,C65671,0

22=R2,34,C65672,0

23=R2,39,C65854,0

24=R2,33,C65856,0

25=R2,35,C65857,0

26=R2,37,C65855,0

27=P2,5,C65860,0

28=P1,1,C65861,0

29=P2,6,C65564,0

[AutoSave]

Next=4

Interval=300

Files=5

SaveOnGround=Yes

AutoSaveEnabled=Yes

1=Thu 010552

2=Thu 011052

3=Thu 011552

4=Sun 013048

5=Thu 005606

6=Tue 202024

7=Tue 202224

8=Tue 202424

9=Tue 202623

10=Tue 200827

[GPSout]

GPSoutEnabled=No

Port=COM0

Speed=4800

Interval=2000

PosTo6Decimal=No

Sentences=

[GPSout2]

GPSoutEnabled=No

Port=<none set>

Speed=4800

Interval=2000

PosTo6Decimal=No

Sentences=

[WideServer]

WideFSenabled=Yes

[sounds]

Path=D:\Microsoft Flight Simulator X\Sound\

Device1=Primary Sound Driver

Device2=Speakers (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device3=Digital Output (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

Device4=Speakers (Apowersoft_AudioDevice)

Device5=SPDIF Interface (SoundMAX Integrated Digital HD Audio)

[JoystickCalibration]

AllowSuppressForPFCquad=Yes

ExcludeThrottleSet=Yes

ExcludeMixtureSet=Yes

ExcludePropPitchSet=Yes

SepRevsJetsOnly=No

ApplyHeloTrim=No

UseAxisControlsForNRZ=Yes

FlapsSetControl=0

FlapDetents=No

ReverserControl=66292

Reverser1Control=66422

Reverser2Control=66425

Reverser3Control=66428

Reverser4Control=66431

MaxThrottleForReverser=256

AileronTrimControl=66731

RudderTrimControl=66732

CowlFlaps1Control=66162

CowlFlaps2Control=66163

CowlFlaps3Control=66164

CowlFlaps4Control=66165

SteeringTillerControl=0

MaxSteerSpeed=60

Aileron=-16384,0,0,16383

Elevator=-16384,0,0,16383

Rudder=-16383,0,0,16384/16

Flaps=-16383,16384/16

Spoilers=-16384,16128/16

Throttle1=-16384,-512,512,16383/32

Throttle2=-16253,-512,512,16383/32

[Axes]

0=0S,256,D,3,0,0,0

1=1X,256,D,22,0,0,0

2=1Y,256,F,65820,65821,0,0

3=1Z,256,F,65821,0,0,0

4=2X,256,D,1,0,0,0

5=2Y,256,D,2,0,0,0

6=2U,256,D,23,0,0,0

7=2V,256

8=2V,D,-16384,-3381,66080,0

9=2V,U,9728,16383,66079,0

10=2V,B,1536,6528,65700,0

[Axes.]

0=0S,256,D,3,0,0,0

1=1X,256,D,22,0,0,0

2=1Y,256,D,9,0,0,0

3=1Z,256,D,10,0,0,0

4=2X,256,D,1,0,0,0

5=2Y,256,D,2,0,0,0

6=2U,256,D,23,0,0,0

7=2V,256

8=2V,D,-16384,-3381,66080,0

9=2V,U,9728,16383,66079,0

10=2V,B,1536,6528,65700,0

[Profile.]

1=

[Pete Dowson]

Good morning Pete, thanks for your help in this. I did try assigning them late last night as suggested, still through FSUIPC but not using the direct to FSUIPC calibration but rather the middle radio button option, I think I had to untick the Ignore throttle set or something in the 4 throttle calibration page.

You assigned to the wrong FS controls then! The correct ones are the ones I said -- Axis throttleN set, not ThrottleN set. The former ARE the FSX controls, the latter are the ones FSUIPC uses for a reverse zone. You certainly do NOT have to uncheck the "ignored throttleN set" option if you do the correct thing as I suggested! By assigning to the wrong controls you are still fooling the PMDG code which is obviously looking for the normal FS Axis controls, not the others!!

:sad:

Also, I worked on this:

Meant to add Pete when No Reverse Zone is ticked I get the following

Throttle 1

(Idle) In -16253 Out -16252 (Max) In 16383 Out 16384

Throttle 2

(Idle) In -16384 Out -4096****** (Max) In 16256 Out 16224

I think the -4096 is the culprit to throttle 2 only returning to 50% on manual thrust despite the lever being returned to idle

And ... as far as I can see here, it is not actually even possible to get a value less than 0 displayed for "OUT" if the "No Reverse Zone" option is ticked. The action of that option is sepcifically to map the whole range to only the positive values. I am therefore left wondering how you arrived at this result. Also, I cannot reproduce the discrepancy between throttle1 and throttle2 that you show here at all, even by unchecking the NRZ option.

So, unless you think you may have been mistaken, I need to determine what circumstances can lead to what you saw so I can fix it. if you can definitely reproduce that error, could you do so, but first enable some extra logging, like this:

In the [General] section of FSUIPC4.INI add:

LogAxes=Yes

Debug=Please

LogExtras=x8

This won't log the values seen in the Calibration settings, so please write those down. Thanks!

Oh, it might be a good idea to use the same FSUIPC version as me -- 4.804, from the Download Links subforum.

Thanks

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Pete it will probably be Sunday evening or early next week before I can look into this as I'm away all weekend. I just typed a long message and blinking lost it as the page refreshed by accident :mad: I'll look for the 'axis throttle n set' options and test that along with the sync (if required) and report back. I suppose its critical that you choose the correct tye of action required i.e. direct to fsuipc or fs as normal axis as they contain differing control options.

I'm also having issues trying to assign an axis as the tiller steering for NGX. I tried it on a spare lever which worked fine, it went from -16384 to +16384 but when I removed this axis and assigned it to another, as its original position conflicted with other levers and my hand nudging it by accident, its range is weird, it would go from -16384 to +16384 with the lever moving 50% of its full range then repeat for the final 50%, this means when I move it from say full idle the aircraft would turn to the right then straighten up, go left, straighten up then right again all within the full 0-100% movement of the lever...any ideas? I'm now using the latest module. Perhaps I should should completely start over yet again

Chris Ibbotson

[Pete Dowson]

I'll look for the 'axis throttle n set' options

They are not 'options', they are just the standard FS controls, and since they start with "Axis" they appear near the beginning of the drop-down assignments list, not much further down like the "ThrottleN Set" controls you previously assigned. Those are the controls you should have been using all along, as advised. I don't know why you chose the others.

its range is weird, it would go from -16384 to +16384 with the lever moving 50% of its full range then repeat for the final 50%, this means when I move it from say full idle the aircraft would turn to the right then straighten up, go left, straighten up then right again all within the full 0-100% movement of the lever...any ideas?

It sounds like you have dual assignments to that lever so they are conflicting.

Pete

[cjibbotson]

Pete

I did a quick test by assigning the two throttle levers as 'axis throttle 1 set' and 'axis throttle 2 set'. I had previously set them as 'throttle 1' and 'throttle 2' as this is the only references I recall to individual throttles when using the direct option (which I thought was the better one), I went to the calibration page and calibrated both, setting the max and min values. Tested the NGX and the throttles worked as they should with the auto throttle switched on (i.e. they didnt change when I moved the Saitek levers). The no reverse option is ticked and confirmed as Yes in ini file. The In / Out values range from -16384 to +16384. I then tried the sync option, I moved both levers to idle and pressed the sync position button then moved both levers simultaneously about 1cm and pressed sync again...as soon as I did this throttle 2's Out value on left hand side of display changed from -16384 to -4096 (and wont go below this value) and wouldn't increase until the lever approached the 50% range of its physical movement where it starts increasing to +16384. I did email my office the ini file so I could post it for you to view it but it hasn't come through as I forgot to switch on Outlook after selecting the file and pressing 'Send to Mail', I will post its contents later on this evening before I'm away for the weekend. I didn't have time to enable any logs you requested at present. I reset the throttle calibration and tried again and again and again but same thing happened when enabling the sync mode. In the past I tried different axis levers as I have 6 on the 2 quadrants but same issue. In manual thrust control throttle 2 stops around 50% and wont return to idle. I tested it also on Flight1's BN2 Islander, a twin prop, and same result.

Regarding the tiller I did have the landing gear configured for that lever originally but cleared the axis and removed the 2 range settings I had for the Up and Down. I'll restart the entire setup to be sure I've a clean sheet, the clean setup however didnt cure the sync issues as I recently tested this. Also for your info I have FSX Controllers disabled, do you think I should delete all its axis assignments as well as disabling them? I can live without the sync option if we can't get to the bottom of it.

Hope you have a good weekend

Chris Ibbotson