Reversers conflicting with Throttles :-(

[Chris Catalano]

Hi Everyone:

 

I am a new user of the payware version of FSUIPC4.  I just purchased a new throttle console/flight yoke console setup from Precision Flight Controls.  I only fly the PMDG 737NGX.  I was mostly successful in setting up all the controls tonight, but one problem lingers.  It seems that the throttles are conflicting with the reversers.  I have a 6 lever throttle console from PFC (Speedbrakes, Left engine, left reverser, right reverser, right engine, flaps).  It seems that whenever I retard the throttles, the reversers automatically come on - even though I specifically made sure I configured it in the settings page to NOT use the reversers for the throttles (there were only TWO settings to "SET" - no middle detene setting.)  Then also to make things more complicated, whenever I pull the reverser levers, they spool up, but then they don't "shut off" when I bring them back down to iidle.  It seems the only way I can get them to stop reversing is to nudge the Land R engine throttles forward a bit and then retard the engine handles once more.  Finally, I might add that whenever I leave FSX and go into the FSUIPC menu, and then I return to FSX, the reversers automatically come on for some reason.  I have disabled all controls in the FSX menu and I am running everything through FSUIPC.

 

Can anyone help me to finish configuring this?  Otherwise, I am having a tremendous amount of success with the program!

 

Thank you,

 

Chris Catalano

[Tigh]

Hi Chris,

 

I set a range on my reverser axes. The first part fo the range is blank so any spikes won't conflict with the throttles (as you're seeing). The first third (so from around 12,000) is assigned to cut the throttle to ensure the reversers will engage, then I use Throttle Decr Small in the next range and then Throttle Decr in the final range so I have at least some control over how much reverser I have.

[Chris Catalano]

Well it seemed to help a bit, but the problem I seem to now have is that both of the Reversers do not seem to work well with one another.  It seems that if I pull both reverser levers at the same time, the right reverser overrides the left one, and while they both begin to spool up togeter, suddenly only the right one continues to rise, while the left one stops rising and spooling up.  Then the only way to get the left one to rise also is to quickkly retard the left lever (resetting it?) and then re engage it, pulling the left one toward me, and then, since it has now been "reset" so to speak, it begins to spool up as it is supposed to.  Not sure if I am making much sense here.  Sorry. :-(

 

Thanks for the help thus far!

 

Chris Catalano

[Pete Dowson]

I have a 6 lever throttle console from PFC (Speedbrakes, Left engine, left reverser, right reverser, right engine, flaps).  It seems that whenever I retard the throttles, the reversers automatically come on - even though I specifically made sure I configured it in the settings page to NOT use the reversers for the throttles (there were only TWO settings to "SET" - no middle detene setting.)

 

Fist, check the box saying "NRZ" or "No reverse zone" (though from what you say I assume you've done that). . Then follow the numbered steps for calibration, making sure you have a good stable idle zone -- an area, not just one position, which is giving zero for the output value. When done correctly there is no possible way to get reverse from the throttle levers themselves -- it will then only be the reversers .... so:

 

 Then also to make things more complicated, whenever I pull the reverser levers, they spool up, but then they don't "shut off" when I bring them back down to iidle.  

 

It's the same thing. You need a null zone, NOT just a single position, which is giving 0 as output for a small range of the reverser. 

 

The problem is that the same position, even at the end stops, is not always giving the same input to the sim. Variations occur due to minor variations in temperature, humidity, voltages, etc. You ALWAYS need max and min areas, not points, same with hands off positions on yokes and pedals.

 

I leave FSX and go into the FSUIPC menu, and then I return to FSX, the reversers automatically come on for some reason. 

 

 

 

Again, it's exactly the same reason

 

Pete

[Chris Catalano]

Hi Again:

 

OK - getting a little discouraged now - :-(  I already had null zones created for each reverser (L and R).  I just added a null zone for each throttle too (L and R).  Here are the numbers I chose - Reversers - normally the extreme point "off" is at 16,461.  Now with the null zone, the reversers do not engage until 14,661.  The throttles usually are at idle at -16,383.  Now they do not engage or spool up until -14,661.  Bt the strangest thing happns.  If I am taxiing on the ground, I can try the reversers in conjunction with the throttles and they always work fine.  But as soon as I do a landing, they will not engage.  I pull them forward and nothing happens.  Then I ritard the reversers, then I simple nudge the throttles forward a bit, then cut the throttles immediately back to idle, and THEN I retry the reversers, and they work perfectly!  For some reason, I have to first hit the ground, nudge the throttles up and down for a moment, then the reveressers will allow me to use them correctly.  I am getting a bit discouraged because everything else is working perfectly right now with my PMDG 737 NGX.

 

Thanks for the help thus far!

 

Chris Catalano

[srcooke]

Hello Chris,

 

It's an issue with the throttle lever position of the NGX on landing, they are not on the stops ( possibly from the approach idle implementation). You could assign a 'Throttle Cut' in the base range of the reverser's possibly using both UP and Down, that would nudge the throttles on to the stop as you operate the reverser.

 

Alternatively, and probably a better implementation, is to set the cut on the throttles idle zone on the Down command. Pulling your throttles on to the stop 'after landing' sending a cut to the NGX.

 

You may find other workarounds on the NGX forum on Avsim.

[Pete Dowson]

Hi Again:

 

OK - getting a little discouraged now - :sad:  I already had null zones created for each reverser (L and R).  I just added a null zone for each throttle too (L and R).  Here are the numbers I chose - Reversers - normally the extreme point "off" is at 16,461.  Now with the null zone, the reversers do not engage until 14,661.  The throttles usually are at idle at -16,383.  Now they do not engage or spool up until -14,661.  Bt the strangest thing happns.  If I am taxiing on the ground, I can try the reversers in conjunction with the throttles and they always work fine.  But as soon as I do a landing, they will not engage.  I pull them forward and nothing happens.  Then I ritard the reversers, then I simple nudge the throttles forward a bit, then cut the throttles immediately back to idle, and THEN I retry the reversers, and they work perfectly! 

 

This is all because the throttles MUST be at idle before you can use the reversers. The symptoms you describe are EXACTLY what you'd see if the throttles were not at idle.

 

Use FSUIPC's Axis logging to see what is going on. It still sounds like you have not actually set true idle zones which are 100% consistently set when you have the throttles full back and the reversers full forward.

 

If you (temporarily) use FS in Windowed mode and enable the FSUIPC console logging you'll be able to see that actual numbers in real time on screen as you move these levers.

 

[EDIT] I see Stephen has said it's a PMDG problem. I didn't know that, so sorry if I appeared to be bullying you about the idle zone. I was unaware of any PMDG bug like this. I should have suggested testing with a default aircraft first to eliminate such bugs in add-ons.

 

Pete

[Chris Catalano]

One user suggested that PMDG recommends holding the F1 key after touchdown to bring the throttle levers on to the stops, thus allowing the reversers to operate.

 

I assigned a hot key to this and had somewhat successful results last night.  I am not sure what will get it to ALWAYS operate correctly, but at least I see this solution has potential.  I am not entirely sure precisely what I have to do make it work consistently all the time.  But I feel as if I am getting closer to a resolution.

 

Thanks for your patience and support.

 

Chris Catalano

[Pete Dowson]

One user suggested that PMDG recommends holding the F1 key after touchdown to bring the throttle levers on to the stops, thus allowing the reversers to operate.

 

I assigned a hot key to this and had somewhat successful results last night.  I am not sure what will get it to ALWAYS operate correctly, but at least I see this solution has potential.  I am not entirely sure precisely what I have to do make it work consistently all the time.  But I feel as if I am getting closer to a resolution.

 

If you are assigning the throttle via FSUIPC, then as well as the assignment on the left in the Axes tab, on the right you can assign FS controls to operate when the lever is moved through or into defined regions. F1 by default is assigned to the FS control "throttle cut", so try assigning Throttle Cut to the range near and into your idle zone, selecting only the down direction (so it doesn't get sent when trying to increase throttle).

 

Pete

[Chris Catalano]

Hi Pete:

 

Thanks for all the help.  Stephen (above) sent me a very similar solution where I created the throttle cut with the advancing of the reversers rather than the pulling back the throttles, and lo and behold!  It works!!! It is perfect now!  Thank you so very much for the help and the guidance!  I love your program!  I don't know how I lived so long without it!

 

Sincerely,

 

Chris Catalano