Problem with PFC ver 1.84 on FS9

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

just installed the new version to try out the "equalize" feature. When I called up the driver window in FS all the pages right of the console page were not visible. I seem to remember this was also there with one of the earlier version but can't exactly recall which one.

Any ideas?

Kind regards,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

just installed the new version to try out the "equalize" feature. When I called up the driver window in FS all the pages right of the console page were not visible. I seem to remember this was also there with one of the earlier version but can't exactly recall which one.

Oh no, not that again. :cry: :cry: :cry:

It means it cannot find the correct place to get the lists of FS controls. It gets this through FSUIPC. In FSUIPC can you get the FS control drop-downs to work in the Keys or Buttons pages? What version is FSUIPC?

I've changed none of the code that deals with this stuff at all. I don't understand. And I'm afraid I may not have time to deal with it until I return from holiday on March 12th. I will try to make a quick test version for you to try later today ...

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

Oh no, not that again. :cry: :cry: :cry:

I'm very sorry, but I'm afraid this is going to be still more strange.

In FSUIPC can you get the FS control drop-downs to work in the Keys or Buttons pages? What version is FSUIPC?

I cannot answer this in one sentence, so here is what I did.

FSUIPC is 3.14.

After experiencing the prob I reinstalled PFC 1.831. All pages were back but the driver window would allways come up with the single prop non-carbureted quadrant activated. I have never used that and I have made no assignments of quadrants to specific aircraft. I changed that but after the next launch it was back to single. I let PFC rebuild a new ini but still the same. I was not able to make my selection of the twin prop quadrant stay.

After reading your reply I installed ver 1.84 again. And no comes the strangest of all: IT WORKED. I was really in doubt of my mental abilities for a moment.

I shut down FS and relaunched it and the problem was there again.

Repeated that procedure - same thing. Then I only closed the driver window and had a look at FSUIPC. I was able to access the controls drop down lists. After that I called up the PFC window again.

All the pages were back! Within that same session!

It seemed that if the problem occurs I have to close the driver window, wait a few seconds and then retry. Then all the pages were back.

On some more tests I found that when I waited really long (1 min) after FS seemed to be fully loaded then all pages were there and also the quadrant I wanted was active.

I think I didn't call up the driver window too early before. I allways waited till there was no more hard disc access.

I'm pretty confused now. May be this is a timing problem or a problem with the order in which the modules are loaded? It may also be that it is related to my system only.

I don't know.

Kind regards,

Frank

p.s. Don't let that worry you, I can live with how it turned out now.

Enjoy your holidays.

[Pete Dowson]

After experiencing the prob I reinstalled PFC 1.831. All pages were back but the driver window would allways come up with the single prop non-carbureted quadrant activated. I have never used that and I have made no assignments of quadrants to specific aircraft. I changed that but after the next launch it was back to single. I let PFC rebuild a new ini but still the same. I was not able to make my selection of the twin prop quadrant stay.

That's not like anything I've ever heard of before. Do you have automatic quadrant selection enabled? You are getting the default if it cannot find a suitable quadrant. It will also default to than if NONE of the quadrants are checked as enabled.

After reading your reply I installed ver 1.84 again. And no comes the strangest of all: IT WORKED. I was really in doubt of my mental abilities for a moment.

I shut down FS and relaunched it and the problem was there again.

Repeated that procedure - same thing. Then I only closed the driver window and had a look at FSUIPC. I was able to access the controls drop down lists. After that I called up the PFC window again.

All the pages were back! Within that same session!

It seemed that if the problem occurs I have to close the driver window, wait a few seconds and then retry. Then all the pages were back.

On some more tests I found that when I waited really long (1 min) after FS seemed to be fully loaded then all pages were there and also the quadrant I wanted was active.

All this indicates is a timing difference. FSUIPC has to initialise the values. But it should have done that LONG before you can get into PFC's options.

I think I didn't call up the driver window too early before. I allways waited till there was no more hard disc access.

Version 1.84 of PFC is more careful how it initialises now. It does not start until you are ready to fly. If you had an avionics stack you'd not see the radio frequencies and so on get filled in until then. I did this because there were possibilities otherwise of PFC seeing switch changes and trying to send controls to FS before the aircraft is fully loaded. This can crash FS quite easily.

Anyway, I will make the PFC options code obtain the Controls list data from FSUIPC dynamically, when needed, rather than rely on it getting them initially, once and for all. That should fix that problem. I'll send an interim update to you shortly. See if you can break that. :wink:

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

That's not like anything I've ever heard of before. Do you have automatic quadrant selection enabled? You are getting the default if it cannot find a suitable quadrant. It will also default to than if NONE of the quadrants are checked as enabled.

No, no such thing. The only quadrant I ever used is the Twin Prop. Nine default quadrants are enabled but no one but the TwinProp was ever active. And automatic selection is not enabled.

All this indicates is a timing difference. FSUIPC has to initialise the values. But it should have done that LONG before you can get into PFC's options.

Hm..., as I said, I wait until FS has settled (no more hard disc access, clouds and vis loaded and aircraft sitting on the tarmac). But I can well wait a few moments more :) .

Version 1.84 of PFC is more careful how it initialises now....I did this because there were possibilities otherwise of PFC seeing switch changes and trying to send controls to FS before the aircraft is fully loaded. This can crash FS quite easily.

Yes, I see.

Anyway, I will make the PFC options code obtain the Controls list data from FSUIPC dynamically, when needed, rather than rely on it getting them initially, once and for all. That should fix that problem. I'll send an interim update to you shortly.

Thank you very much for this. Great support!

See if you can break that. :wink:

:lol: :lol: :lol: Nice to see that you are keeping your sense of humor.

Thanks again, regards,

Frank

[Frank.O]

Pete,

I just received the interim version and tried it.

I did 5 different tests and it allways worked like a charme, no matter how early I called up the PFC driver window.

Thank you very much for this.

I've also tested the "equalize" feature and I'm absoluteley amazed. It really works very well. The prop sync spinner on my panel for the first time didn't do any move for an entire one hour flight and the last remnants of that "snake dancing" are definitely gone. Great.

Oh... if this could be made switchable via a button or key so I could turn it on and off with a switch on the cirrus (Alternate Air would be fine), then I could forget about the FS internal prop sync forever, because this one really works. :wink: :D

All the best,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

if this could be made switchable via a button or key so I could turn it on and off with a switch on the cirrus

Why would you want it switchable? It is only equalising the values when the difference is less than the maximum possible error on the PFC axes (ie twice the resolution). Once the difference is greater than that it is doing nothing in any case.

Pete

[nmthomas]

Pete,

Have installed and only checked digital filtering & equalize and Frank O is correct in that I believe the 'Snake Dance" is history.

The problem I had with 2 a/c is gone and I can politely say thank you for I'm sure very hard work.

Take a vacation relax and enjoy you deserve it. Oh, I too have seen the top show up partial on the pfc call up page but I pull up again and all is there.

Take care have a greay holiday.

Regards, Nick :D :D :D :D

[Frank.O]

Why would you want it switchable? It is only equalising the values when the difference is less than the maximum possible error on the PFC axes (ie twice the resolution). Once the difference is greater than that it is doing nothing in any case.

Because it could replace the internal prop sync then. Engaging the prop sync when the engines are set very differently is not reasonable in my opinion. So this feature does exactly what prop sync is supposed to do. Beeing able to switch it off would also help on the ground when differential thrust is used to help with steering, because slightly different throttle settings are required here. I could then remove the prop sync switch from my panel and use this feature instead.

Kind regards,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

Beeing able to switch it off would also help on the ground when differential thrust is used to help with steering, because slightly different throttle settings are required here.

But if the unreliablility of the inputs from the axes is more than than the difference you want for steering you cannot reliably set such a difference in any case. It still makes no sense to have it switchable. If you need it you need it, if not you don't.

If you have enabled it and use it it is because you find you cannot find points on your controls which give identical engine settings, and this matters because the aircraft you are flying is very sensitive to very small (2-3%) differences -- when flying. But surely 2-3% difference on the ground is not going to be of specific help in steering and even if it was you are relying on something from your controls which you are explicitly NOT able to rely on! It's a complete contradiction, if you see what I mean!

Surely, for steering, just use a little more difference. Then the equalisation is removed in any case.

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Pete,

You are right in what you're saying about the unreliability of the inputs and so on. Well, don't take this too seriously all together, it was just a thought of mine. It is very good as it is now and further changes are not really needed.

It just felt a bit trickier to keep the Baron straight and maintain a proper taxi speed when taxiing in a moderate crosswind, so I thought I might ask.

Stop working now and prepare for your holidays :) .

Regards,

Frank