question for PFC Avionics users

[blave]

I know that Pete is taking a well-deserved vacation right now, but I thought I'd post this to see if anyone else has the same issue... I am having a problem that I *believe* is a new bug in version 3.20/3.201. Here is what I see:

1. rename fsuipc.ini to something else to ensure that FSUIPC.DLL creates a fresh one.

2. start FS2004 with (e.g.) the Baron; but any airplane should do.

3. apply full throttle

4. press any of these buttons in the GPS section of the avionics panel: NAV-GPS, D->, MSG, ON-OFF.

5. on my system, the throttle(s) go to zero - as if a "throttle cut" command has been sent to FS2004.

At first I thought it was the keystroke generation assignments I had set up causing this, but after lots of headscratching and troubleshooting, I finally got to the point of doing step (1) first, so as to eliminate any custom FSUIPC configuration. It still does what I describe, so I wanted to see if any other PFC avionics users are seeing this behavior.

Reverting back to FSUIPC 3.135 eliminates this problem, but then I lose the new GoFlight capabilities...

Is anyone else seeing this anomaly?

thx,

Dave Blevins

[Frank.O]

Hi Dave,

I encountered not exactly the same but similar problems. I hadd assigned all the GPS buttons to operate the FS9 GPS via FSUIPC. It seems that the assignments in FSUIPC no longer override the standard settings in the PFC driver. Also I had assigned the com radio on/off buttons to "comX_transmit_select". When I press an on/off button the radio is activated on the audio panel but the unit on the avionics goes off. It seems that both commands, the one assigned in the PFC driver and the one assigned via FSUIPC, are being executed. I cleared all assignements in the PFC driver so the respective buttons worked again but those not assignable in the PFC driver cause problems.

I also deleted all ini files and in the following session made all my assignments and calibrations from scratch (1 hour) and it worked for that session. Once FS9 was closed and relaunched the problems were back.

I reverted back to FSUIPC 3.14 and PFC.dll 1.841 and this works as expected.

Let Pete enjoy his hollidays and see what he comes up with when he's back. If you don't have a working set of files until then give me an email adress and I'll send them to you.

Regards,

Frank

[blave]

Frank,

Somehow I knew you'd be a respondent to my post :)

Thanks for your info - it does look like something has gone wonky with the driver(s). I do have prior versions of both programs (although I was able to fix this by loading only an older version of FSUIPC) so I'm OK. (I do think my problem is slightly different, as (to my knowledge) the GPS buttons don't do anything at all in FS unless you custom-program them. I was unable to determine what's unique about those four buttons from a keycode or whatever standpoint, but I'll leave it to Pete from here on out.)

BTW I'm doing the same thing as you w.r.t. the GPS section, except I use the RealityXP 530XP. For a while I had the FS9 GPS set up with the same assignments, and it was interesting to have them both displayed and see the divergence in the two GPS's behavior....

cheers,

dB.

[Pete Dowson]

It seems that both commands, the one assigned in the PFC driver and the one assigned via FSUIPC, are being executed.

Oh dear, that's odd. :(

I'm trying to catch up with emails and things at present, but I'll take a look at that on Monday, latest.

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Oh dear, that's odd. :(

I'm trying to catch up with emails and things at present, but I'll take a look at that on Monday, latest.

Ah..., take your time Pete, no need to hurry :wink:

Hope you enjoyed your vacation. How were the steam railways in Cuba? :)

Regards,

Frank

[Pete Dowson]

I encountered not exactly the same but similar problems. I hadd assigned all the GPS buttons to operate the FS9 GPS via FSUIPC. It seems that the assignments in FSUIPC no longer override the standard settings in the PFC driver.

That cannot be anything like Dave's problem as he explicitly stated he was starting with a fresh default FSUIPC INI file -- i.e. with no programmed PFC buttons in FSUIPC at all.

After several hours of NOT being able to reproduce your problem, Frank, I found it -- the programming of PFC buttons in FSUIPC does override the PFC action, but only in the same session you programmed them, or if you change some other programming in the Buttons page so making FSUIPC scan the data again. Took me ages as I didn't realise you needed to program the button, close FS, then reload it before you got the problem!

Seems the initial loading of the data from the INI file isn't setting the override matrix correctly. I'll fix that, it is easy enough, but Dave's problem is something else entirely. I cannot understand it.

Regards,

Pete

[Pete Dowson]

I am having a problem that I *believe* is a new bug in version 3.20/3.201

I've been trying to work out what could be going on with your system. You say:

1. rename fsuipc.ini to something else to ensure that FSUIPC.DLL creates a fresh one.

2. start FS2004 with (e.g.) the Baron; but any airplane should do.

3. apply full throttle

4. press any of these buttons in the GPS section of the avionics panel: NAV-GPS, D->, MSG, ON-OFF.

5. on my system, the throttle(s) go to zero - as if a "throttle cut" command has been sent to FS2004.

... but I don't see how this can possibly be FSUIPC because by using a new default FSUIPC INI you most definitely have go no PFC buttons programmed in its Buttons page. Frank's problem is entirely different and I think I've found that.

By default, without Project Magenta's MCP running, the GPS buttons in PFC do nothing -- they aren't even all available for you to program. In fact the ones you mention (NAV-GPS, D->, MSG, ON-OFF) are only programmable in FSUIPC -- in PFC with no PM running they are dead, ignored.

In order to understand what is happening on your system I need to know rather more about what you've got installed, what is running, what you've programmed. Please also check those buttons in PFC test mode.

If the PM MCP is running, then NAV/GPS toggles "N1" (TO/GA by default in FS) which could cut the throttle, ON/OFF is the IAS/MACH selector, D-> sets A/P SPD mode and MSG is VNAV. None of these latter ones would do anything noticeable if the A/P is off.

Reverting back to FSUIPC 3.135 eliminates this problem, but then I lose the new GoFlight capabilities...

Erthis is even more puzzling, as there are no changes in FSUIPC which would affect PFC. They are different programs. I really need a lot more help understanding this, please.

Regards,

Pete

[Frank.O]

Hi Pete,

That cannot be anything like Dave's problem as he explicitly stated he was starting with a fresh default FSUIPC INI file -- i.e. with no programmed PFC buttons in FSUIPC at all.

you're right. I should have expressed it better. "Similar" was just meant in the sense of "buttons doing not what tey are expected to do here also".

the programming of PFC buttons in FSUIPC does override the PFC action, but only in the same session you programmed them, ....Took me ages as I didn't realise you needed to program the button, close FS, then reload it before you got the problem!

That's what I said in my post actually. :)

... made all my assignments and calibrations from scratch (1 hour) and it worked for that session. Once FS9 was closed and relaunched the problems were back.

Seems the initial loading of the data from the INI file isn't setting the override matrix correctly. I'll fix that, it is easy enough

Oh, that's really good news, thanks for taking the time. Unfortunately I'll not be able to do any testing at the moment. I'm grounded :( .

For the second time within two years I had to send my Cirrus2 for repairs :( . They told me I was the only customer they have who ever had problems with it. :?

Can take a while till I'll have it back :cry: .

Regards,

Frank

[blave]

Hi Pete,

Welcome back. Sorry, I haven't monitored the forum for a few days...

I did some add'l testing tonight. I have a *little* bit more data.

My setup includes the PFC avionics stack, and several GoFlight modules including the MCP autopilot.

So I just fired up the Learjet and did a quick flight. This is what I've found:

* I renamed FSUIPC.INI to somethng else, so that FS does not load it. I left PFC.INI alone.

* I started up FS2004 and loaded the Learjet. (Note: the avionics are the RealityXP JetLine4 instruments, but I have noticed the described behavior with other non-JL4-enabled aircraft as well.

* I set the GoFlight autopilot up for hdg/altitude/speed targets.

* I press the PFC stack's Direct To button - which is theoretically not programmed to anything since the FSUIPC.INI file has been renamed. HOWEVER, I note that pressing this button disables the IAS/Mach Hold mode of the autopilot - i.e. the HOLD LED on the GoFlight MCP turns off. This also results in the throttle being backed off quite a bit.

* pressing the GPS ON/OFF and NAV/GPS buttons also do things to the MCP, e.g. switch the SEL button from IAS to Mach, etc.

(update: I just tried it with the stock C172 as well. Lifting off in the 172, with full power (but without the autopilot being engaged), and then pressing the Direct To button on the PFC stack causes the C172's throttle to go to idle.)

This anomalous behavior seems to be limited to just a few buttons on the PFC stack - i.e. almost like just a few keycodes are getting duplicated or something. The NAV/GPS, ON/OFF, Direct To, and maybe (I didn't test this tonight) the ENT buttons on the PFC stack are the only misbehaving ones that I'm aware of.

The only thing I can surmise at this point is that the addition of the GoFlight programming has somehow resulted in some heretofore unrealized problem in the PFC panel code - which is not dependent on how I have those buttons programmed since I'm starting out with a fresh FSUIPC.INI.

Let me know if you need more details or testing on my part. I have attached my current FSUIPC.INI (after renaming it, running FS2004, and then exiting FS) to the end of this post.

cheers,

dB.

I am having a problem that I *believe* is a new bug in version 3.20/3.201

I've been trying to work out what could be going on with your system. You say:

1. rename fsuipc.ini to something else to ensure that FSUIPC.DLL creates a fresh one.

2. start FS2004 with (e.g.) the Baron; but any airplane should do.

3. apply full throttle

4. press any of these buttons in the GPS section of the avionics panel: NAV-GPS, D->, MSG, ON-OFF.

5. on my system, the throttle(s) go to zero - as if a "throttle cut" command has been sent to FS2004.

... but I don't see how this can possibly be FSUIPC because by using a new default FSUIPC INI you most definitely have go no PFC buttons programmed in its Buttons page. Frank's problem is entirely different and I think I've found that.

By default, without Project Magenta's MCP running, the GPS buttons in PFC do nothing -- they aren't even all available for you to program. In fact the ones you mention (NAV-GPS, D->, MSG, ON-OFF) are only programmable in FSUIPC -- in PFC with no PM running they are dead, ignored.

In order to understand what is happening on your system I need to know rather more about what you've got installed, what is running, what you've programmed. Please also check those buttons in PFC test mode.

If the PM MCP is running, then NAV/GPS toggles "N1" (TO/GA by default in FS) which could cut the throttle, ON/OFF is the IAS/MACH selector, D-> sets A/P SPD mode and MSG is VNAV. None of these latter ones would do anything noticeable if the A/P is off.

Reverting back to FSUIPC 3.135 eliminates this problem, but then I lose the new GoFlight capabilities...

Erthis is even more puzzling, as there are no changes in FSUIPC which would affect PFC. They are different programs. I really need a lot more help understanding this, please.

Regards,

Pete

[General]

History=U41XQTODX7T1DRHAYD5PS

WindSmoothing=No

WhiteMessages=No

ThrottleSyncAll=No

GraduatedVisibility=No

LowerVisAltitude=6000

UpperVisAltitude=25000

UpperVisibility=6000

GenerateCirrus=Yes

WindShearSharp=No

UpperWindGusts=No

ExtendMetarMaxVis=Yes

PatchSimApAlt=Yes

AutoClearWeather=Yes

ExtendTopWind=Yes

WindSmoothness=5

SmoothPressure=No

PressureSmoothness=5

SmoothVisibility=No

VisibilitySmoothness=2

MaxSurfaceWind=0

WindLimitLevel=200

WindDiscardLevel=400

WindAjustAltitude=No

WindAjustAltitudeBy=2000

MinimumVisibility=0

MaximumVisibilityFewClouds=0

MaximumVisibility=0

MaximumVisibilityOvercast=0

MaximumVisibilityRainy=0

OneCloudLayer=No

ThinClouds=No

ThinThunderClouds=No

CloudThinness=1000

ThunderCloudThinness=10000

CloudTurbulence=No

CloudIcing=No

WindTurbulence=No

SuppressAllGusts=No

ExternalOptionControl=Yes

AutoTuneADF=No

KeepFS98CloudCover=No

ShowPMcontrols=No

MagicBattery=No

RudderSpikeRemoval=No

ElevatorSpikeRemoval=No

AileronSpikeRemoval=No

ReversedElevatorTrim=No

TrapUserInterrupt=Yes

NavFreq50KHz=No

ClockSync=No

SmoothIAS=Yes

SetVisUpperAlt=No

VisUpperAltLimit=6000

MaxIce=3

SuppressCloudTurbulence=No

SuppressWindTurbulence=No

SpoilerIncrement=512

TCASid=Flight

TCASrange=40

TrafficScanPerFrame=10

AxisCalibration=No

CentredDialogue=Yes

ClearWeatherDynamics=Yes

OwnWeatherChanges=No

FixWindows=No

FixControlAccel=No

WeatherReadInterval=4

MoveBGLvariables=Yes

MainMenu=&Modules

SubMenu=&FSUIPC ...

[JoystickCalibration]

FlapsSetControl=0

ReverserControl=66292

MaxThrottleForReverser=0

AileronTrimControl=0

RudderTrimControl=0

.end post.

[Pete Dowson]

* I press the PFC stack's Direct To button - which is theoretically not programmed to anything since the FSUIPC.INI file has been renamed. HOWEVER, I note that pressing this button disables the IAS/Mach Hold mode of the autopilot - i.e. the HOLD LED on the GoFlight MCP turns off. This also results in the throttle being backed off quite a bit.

* pressing the GPS ON/OFF and NAV/GPS buttons also do things to the MCP, e.g. switch the SEL button from IAS to Mach, etc.

....

The only thing I can surmise at this point is that the addition of the GoFlight programming has somehow resulted in some heretofore unrealized problem in the PFC panel code - which is not dependent on how I have those buttons programmed since I'm starting out with a fresh FSUIPC.INI.

No, it really absolutely cannot be anything whatsoever to do with FSUIPC!

In fact it sounds like the PFC driver is doing EXACTLY the right things according to the programming in the PFC driver!

Please get your PFC.DLL documentation out and refer to the section entitled "Extended autopilot features (Jetliner console) OR ...". It says

"On the Jetliner console the larger section below the Bendix-King style Autopilot section is totally dedicated to some more advanced autopilot and avionics functions, applicable to modern airliners. These functions are also available on the GPS and Altitude Pre-selector sections of the separate Avionics stack, the allocations being as illustrated here from the Jetliner".

Look at the allocation of functions for the GPS buttons. Look at the table below showing the fubctions provided on those buttons. This is what you are seeing, isn't it?

It has been like this for a couple of years. This isn't new. Either you've never pressed the buttons before, or you've always (?) overridden them with FSUIPC programming -- though that's relatively recent in fact.

What has probably confused you was the bug in FSUIPC 3.2/3.201 whereby the FSUIPC programming didn't correctly override the PFC functions. That is fixed in 3.202. Please check the Release details in the announcements.

Regards,

Pete