PMDG 737 MSFS 2020: Climb rate reduced when FSUIPC7 running

[GuyNeild]

Good evening,

I have had a quick look through FSUICP7 MSFS forum pages and not seen anyone with the same problem, I have purchased the new release of the PMDG 737 for MSFS 2020, briefly my problem is I can only achieve 190Knts in level flight with my throttles fully open giving me 103% max power,at this setting I should eventually be over-speeding, gear/flaps and air-break are fully home inside and outside the the aircraft but the wind noise sounds like something is deployed, even with autopilot set and auto-throttle set above 190 the aircraft refuses to go any faster, out of desperation after trying to adjust things inside the sim and with the settings of my joystick and throttle software, now and importantly, I do not have FSUICP set to control any setting for any aircraft I have in the sim, it is on because my virtual airlines require it to log my online flying via KCars systems, today just by chance I thought I wounder what will happen if I turn of FSUICP and bingo, the 737 springs into life, I have conducted several flights (Full A to B) using the FMC with a sim brief flight plan and the aircraft responds to the autopilot speeds spot on in all phases of flight.

I have even turned FSUICP on and off during a manual flight/speed test, when on 190Knts max, when off I can almost over speed at any altitude (obviously not when I get into the higher altitudes)  I have noticed on previous post on the forum regarding other issues with the PMDG 737 that you have not had any dealing with the new release but I'm hoping that you might be able to shine some light on my problem?

I hope you had a nice holiday 👍

Regards, Guy.

P.S I also noticed the stabiliser out of trim light is continually flashing and the trim wheel arrow (marker) is completely out of the green and as far forward as it will go when FSUICP is on but the light remains extinguished when FSUICP is off.

[John Dowson]

If you are not using FSUIPC to control the aircraft, it should really not be doing anything... Can you show me your FSUIPC7.ini file, and also an FSUIPC7.log file generated with logging for Events activated. Also, as a test, try (temporarily) renaming your current FSUIPC7.ini file (so that a new/default one will be used) and see if you still have your issue. Also, if you have a registered version, try (temporarily) renaming your FSUIPC7.key file (e.g. to FSUIPC7.key.unused) and see if you get the same issue with an unregistered version.

Also, please let me know what FSUIPC clients you are using - if you run FSUIPC but without the clients running, do you still get the same problem?

John

[GuyNeild]

Good afternoon John,

I have done a test flight with FSUIPC7.log file generated with logging for Events but it is larger than the 20kb allowed, I think I now the reason for that, I have not set up the parking brake in the aircraft, I like to use right click of the mouse to pan around, every time I do it releases the parking break when I'm on the ground.

The flight it self went flawlessly as far as my airspeed was concerned, the aircraft achieved all the correct speeds in the flight per the perimeters set by the Autopilot, now in my excitement I did something silly, not being used to testing I actually did two of your suggestions, I temporarily renamed my current FSUIPC7.ini file and I reset my FSUICP7.key to unused so I don't know which was the fix but it will give me an excuse to do another flight, I will rename my FSUICP7.key back as I actually have purchased FSUICP and I will confirm in a later after a second flight.

Thank you in advance for your help.

Guy.

[GuyNeild]

Test 2,

I'm slightly confused now John, I turned off the sim and made sure FSUICP7 had closed, renamed FSUICP7.key.unused back to the original FSUICP7.key, started the sim and set up the flight and again the aircraft speed is performing perfectly in all perimeters of flight set to the sim-brief flight plan, If I'm correct the only thing that has changed is my FSUICP is now running on the newly built FSUIPC7.ini file?

I am even for this second test running my VA's KCars logging a flight just make sure that is not a problem in any way but that has recorded and logged the flight no problem, I did keep the Log events running for the 2nd flight test but yet again it is too big to attach to this forum coming in at around 589kb.

So in summery John my original problem of only being able to achieve 193Knots at max thrust appears after these 2 test flights to have been cured, it's a real shame that I have been unable to send you my log events but the PMDG 737 MSFS 2020 performance now looks to have been fixed, I now have to work on honing Joystick/throttles and key presses to how I like them and hopefully become better at flying it.

Your help has been fantastic and much appreciated,

Regards,

Guy.

[John Dowson]

2 hours ago, GuyNeild said:

it is larger than the 20kb allowed

You can zip it - it should compress pretty well.

2 hours ago, GuyNeild said:

I think I now the reason for that, I have not set up the parking brake in the aircraft, I like to use right click of the mouse to pan around, every time I do it releases the parking break when I'm on the ground.

That sounds strange - panning should not affect the parking brakes, and not 'setting them up' should make any difference...

1 hour ago, GuyNeild said:

I'm slightly confused now John, I turned off the sim and made sure FSUICP7 had closed, renamed FSUICP7.key.unused back to the original FSUICP7.key, started the sim and set up the flight and again the aircraft speed is performing perfectly in all perimeters of flight set to the sim-brief flight plan, If I'm correct the only thing that has changed is my FSUICP is now running on the newly built FSUIPC7.ini file?

So it sounds like it is related to something in your original FSUIPC7.ini. You can post that and I will take a look.
You could also try putting it back to see if the problem still occurs. If so, maybe comparing the FSUIPC7.log files produced by the original ini and the new/default ini may show what is happening.

John

[GuyNeild]

Hi John,

please find attached my original FSUICP7.ini

I did zip up the 2 log event files but they are still to big to upload, obviously this means something must be happening in the back ground that is affecting the aircraft but on the 2 test flight in question nothing appeared to be wrong, my speed problem has gone away so I'm not sure what my next step is, no other aircraft had been affected by my speed problem, until I bought and installed the PMDG 737 I was as happy as Larry with everything, what is they say "Ignorance is Bliss"

FSUIPC7.ini

[John Dowson]

On 5/17/2022 at 12:00 AM, GuyNeild said:

I do not have FSUICP set to control any setting for any aircraft I have in the sim

This is not correct....you had some controls to flaps set in your general axis section so this would apply to all aircraft:

Quote

[Axes]
PollInterval=10
RangeRepeatRate=10
0=CZ,R256,F,66534,65698,65698,65698    -{ TO SIM: AXIS_FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET }-
1=CZ,B,-16384,16383,65698,0    -{ TO SIM: AXIS_FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SETEntering=FLAPS_SET }-
 

and you also have some fir specific profiles:

Quote

[Axes.Boeing 747-8i Asobo]
RangeRepeatRate=10
0=CZ,R256
1=CZ,U,0,0,65595,0    -{ Entering=FLAPS_UP }-
3=CU,D,0,0,65603,0    -{ Entering=FLAPS_DOWN }-
 

[Axes.Jersey DC-6B]
RangeRepeatRate=10
0=CZ,1,F,65698,65698,65698,65698    -{ TO SIM: FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET }-
1=CZ,B,-16384,16383,65698,0    -{ TO SIM: FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SET, FLAPS_SETEntering=FLAPS_SET }-
 

You also have various flaps calibration entries:

Quote

Flaps=796,16384
...
Flaps=0,16384/8
...
Flaps=-16384,16384
...
FlapStarts=-16384,5880,16381
FlapEnds=-16384,5880,16381
 

So with the loss of airspeed and the wind noise, I suspect you were deploying your flaps by mistake.

John

[Carliolian]

At last someone else with this problem. I have searched the web extensively all I could find was this link from 2012
https://support.precisionmanuals.com/kb/a103/aircraft-does-not-want-to-climb-or-flies-with-negative-aoa.aspx
from PMDG knowledge base. I removed "Flaps=..." from FSUIPC.ini and 737 profile. It worked for a few flights but then "Flaps=...." reappeared it the 737 profile. Which made me start testing over again. 
During testing  I used buttons to control flaps it appeared to be ok.
I have removed "Flaps=..." again today and all appeared normal.
I use FSUIPC for all my axis including flaps. Now I have also programmed a button to set Flaps 0 in case it comes back.
I will keep you updated if I have further problems.

Frank Darbyshire
    

[GuyNeild]

2 hours ago, John Dowson said:

This is not correct....you had some controls to flaps set in your general axis section so this would apply to all aircraft:

and you also have some fir specific profiles:

You also have various flaps calibration entries:

So with the loss of airspeed and the wind noise, I suspect you were deploying your flaps by mistake.

John

Good morning John,

I remember having a dabble when MSFS 2020 was first released along side my purchase of the Thrustmaster TCA Captain Pack Airbus Edition, I'm afraid I didn't quite understand what I was doing with FSUICP and setting things up with different aircraft within MSFS so I gave up, I thought I had undone the changes I made and returned FSUICP back to default unused state and I had reinstalled it to over write what I had done, which just goes to prove my complete lack off understanding of it, with my obvious limited understanding and knowledge of all things technical with FSUICP and MSFS is there any easy way for me to reset FSUICP back to default where it is not having any affect other than me being able to connect to my VA and anything that requires FSUICP to be installed?

I'm glad in a way that you have pointed out that in fact FSUICP could have been having a effect on the 737 (due to me dabbling in the past) how ever after my last post I have done another flawless flight speed wise (not pilot 🤣) so it still stands that building a new FSUICP7.ini file appears to allow me to fly the 737.

John, I thank you very much for your continued support on this matter, I realise that I am massively under using your product buy returning it to naked version but you would be surprised (perhaps not) how many things say "requires FSUICP" these day and just to receive this level of support means what I paid to have the full version has been worth every penny.

I will need a idiot proof guide on how to undo all the changes you have highlighted if you don't mind.

Thank you in advance,

Guy.

[John Dowson]

3 minutes ago, GuyNeild said:

I'm glad in a way that you have pointed out that in fact FSUICP could have been having a effect on the 737 (due to me dabbling in the past) how ever after my last post I have done another flawless flight speed wise (not pilot 🤣) so it still stands that building a new FSUICP7.ini file appears to allow me to fly the 737.

Yes, as the one you were using had flap assignments that you were unintentionally triggering.

5 minutes ago, GuyNeild said:

I thought I had undone the changes I made and returned FSUICP back to default unused state and I had reinstalled it to over write what I had done

 The way to achieve this is to use the menu option Options -> Reset to Defaults, or just delete your FSUIPC7.ini and let a new one be created.

7 minutes ago, GuyNeild said:

I will need a idiot proof guide on how to undo all the changes you have highlighted if you don't mind.

There is no need...as your only assignments are axis controls to flaps, you may as well just use a default FSUIPC7.ini, as you are at the moment. You could remove the assignment (and calibration) lines from your current ini to maintain the profiles, but as the profiles do nothing without any assignments, there is really no point. However, I have removed these in the attached FSUIPC7.ini...

John

FSUIPC7.ini

[John Dowson]

1 hour ago, Carliolian said:

I removed "Flaps=..." from FSUIPC.ini and 737 profile. It worked for a few flights but then "Flaps=...." reappeared it the 737 profile. Which made me start testing over again. 
During testing  I used buttons to control flaps it appeared to be ok.
I have removed "Flaps=..." again today and all appeared normal.
I use FSUIPC for all my axis including flaps. Now I have also programmed a button to set Flaps 0 in case it comes back.
I will keep you updated if I have further problems.

Assignments will only be added to your FSUIPC7.ini if you add them...
If assigning in FSUIPC7, check that you are using an empty profile for your controllers in MSFS - or at least that you do not have dial assignments - i.e. an axis/button assigned in both MSFS and FSUIPC7.

John

[GuyNeild]

1 hour ago, John Dowson said:

Yes, as the one you were using had flap assignments that you were unintentionally triggering.

 The way to achieve this is to use the menu option Options -> Reset to Defaults, or just delete your FSUIPC7.ini and let a new one be created.

There is no need...as your only assignments are axis controls to flaps, you may as well just use a default FSUIPC7.ini, as you are at the moment. You could remove the assignment (and calibration) lines from your current ini to maintain the profiles, but as the profiles do nothing without any assignments, there is really no point. However, I have removed these in the attached FSUIPC7.ini...

John

FSUIPC7.ini 4.74 kB · 0 downloads

Thank you very much indeed John,

I have downloaded and will install as soon as I have finished my latest flight, I'm am addicted to this 737 now you have fixed it for me.

truly outstanding support, hopefully one day I might have proper dabble without breaking something but not for a while until I feel more comfortable and read a few tutorials.

Cheers,

kind regards,

Guy.   

[Joao de Geus Los]

Hello John
I have a homecockpit with an overhead that I sef made. It is configured with arduino and mobiflight. All of it was built for p3d running with pmdg and FSUIPC. Now with msfs and 737 ng3 I installed mobiflight 9.4, FSUIPC 7 and I uploaded my old pmdg 737ngx arduino config in the new mobiflight.

My problem is:  when I open the msfs and start a flight in msfs, I see that the mobiflight conect with MSFS with the FSUIPC, it recognizes the overhead, becouse the leds, but the command dont work. I need to wait for an update in MSFS, PMDG or FSUIPC? Or I need to reconfigure all inputs in the mobiflight again?

thanks for your attention

Jan

[John Dowson]

The MSFS PMDG 737 is quite different to the P3D version, especially in terms of control. You will have to review and redo all/most of your assignments as well as offsets that you may use. If you are also using the specific FSUIPC offset area for the PMDG 737 then many if these offsets have also changed, and the offset area is not available in the current FSUIPC7 release, although it is available in the latest FSUIPC7 beta which you can download from here: 

The custom controls have also changed, and now use the Rotor Brake control. Information available here:

There are also many presets available for the PMDG 737 which may be easier to use than the custom/Rotor Brake controls/events. Note that in the latest beta, presets are available for assignment by checking the 'Select for preset' checkbox. You can view/search for available presets using the MobiFlight HubHop site (https://hubhop.mobiflight.com/presets/).

John 

[Eugenio Remus]

Hi, I need to bring this topic back to attention, since I started in the very same situation which brought the original user to post it ...

and it is also clear to me that - should I erase my modified FSUIPC.ini - the 737 PMDG would work back to its normal climbing skills with a "virgin" fsuipc.ini ...

But I can't obviously be happy with such a "dismantling" solution, because this means I can no longer use my many many assignments.

Then I need your help to ascertain the specific cause of the malfunction, so that I can fix my FSUIPC.ini and go back to full operations with the 737 PMDG.

Thanks for the attention, and since I already expect that a closer analisys of such file is needed, I am enclosing it right now.

Best regards,

Eugenio Remus

FSUIPC7.zip

[John Dowson]

10 hours ago, Eugenio Remus said:

since I started in the very same situation which brought the original user to post it ...

Better to explain your issue - is it that you have reduced speed while climbing? The OPs problem is that he had flaps deployed - have you checked the position of your flaps and spoilers when you perceive this lack of power?

Your throttle calibration in your B737PMDG profile also looks strange:

Quote

Throttle1=-14693,-14693,-14693,16255/32
Throttle2=-15474,-15474,-15474,16255/32

This looks like you have calibrated with a reverse zone but are not using a reverse zone. Better to calibrate with no reverse zone.

10 hours ago, Eugenio Remus said:

Then I need your help to ascertain the specific cause of the malfunction, so that I can fix my FSUIPC.ini and go back to full operations with the 737 PMDG.

I also need to see your FSUIPC7.log file showing your issue. Set logging for Buttons & Switches and Events for the first test,

Also, please update to 7.4.2, the latest and only supported version of FSUIPC7.

John

[Eugenio Remus]

My situation is depictable almost exactly like it was described at the beginning of this topic: despite flaps being fully retracted (and spoilers obviously down), with sufficient climb power, the aircraft is incapable to climb and keeps its altitude despite autothrottle ON and in VNAV SPD mode, which ought to entitle a 250 kias climb or even more above 10.000 ft. See below what happened today.
Before testing, I updated FSUIPC to 7.4.2 and recalibrated the throttles without reverse zone. (Will re-enclose FSUIPC.ini if needed).
I brought the a/c to a runway, properly configured for takeoff, and began logging with "Buttons & Switches" and "Events" until it showed incapable to normally increase its initial climb. See the FSUIPC.log enclosed.
My operations after I began testing were pretty normal:
- pressed TO/GA
- raised gear after lift off
- selected CMD A to engage the A/P above 1.000 ft
- started to raise flaps after 3,000 ft. agl were reached
- put ldg gear lever and a/brake to OFF
What I noticed was then that despite an 88.4 % N1 of CLB power, with flaps already commanded up (and the spd brk stowed), the a/c couldn't speed up to more than 196 KIAS and substantially stopped climbing and leveled off, with just a slight bit of vertical speed.
Therefore I ended the test and zipped the files and here I am ...
Thanks for the diagnosis.
Best regards,
Eugenio.

FSUIPC7_log.zip

[John Dowson]

1 hour ago, Eugenio Remus said:

My situation is depictable almost exactly like it was described at the beginning of this topic: despite flaps being fully retracted (and spoilers obviously down), with sufficient climb power, the aircraft is incapable to climb and keeps its altitude despite autothrottle ON and in VNAV SPD mode, which ought to entitle a 250 kias climb or even more above 10.000 ft.

But the initial report from the OP looks to have been caused by flaps being accidentally deployed, slowing the aircraft. If the flaps are up and the speed brake stowed, then I have no idea what could be causing a power reduction. However, I cannot see how this cannot be anything that FSUIPC is doing, as it only controls the aircraft model through the assignments you have made. You can test/check this by pausing the sim when you are configured and climbing, exit FSUIPC7, then un-pause the sim. The aircraft should continue climbing at the same rate.

I can only assume that this must somehow be due to the aircraft set-up/configuration. I am no expert in the 737, so maybe better to ask about this on the PMDG forums.

Your log file shows nothing unusual.

John

[Eugenio Remus]

Well, someone who was in my situation asked that on the PMDG forums, and he was told to turn FSUIPC off, and bring the a/c to normal behavior, so it looks like a ping-pong game.

Although it's weird, there has to be something getting in the way ...

I will go back to the PMDG forums and see if there are any news. 

And I will see if quitting FSUIPC in that scenario "unleashes" the aircraft.

Will report back. 

Thanks for now.

[John Dowson]

1 minute ago, Eugenio Remus said:

Well, someone who was in my situation asked that on the PMDG forums, and he was told to turn FSUIPC off, and bring the a/c to normal behavior, so it looks like a ping-pong game.

Although it's weird, there has to be something getting in the way ...

See my last post - I suggested that you try this, and I don't think this will make any difference. FSUIPC allows you to control the aircraft, it does not affect the aircraft model. You need to determine what could be the cause of this loss of power.

3 minutes ago, Eugenio Remus said:

And I will see if quitting FSUIPC in that scenario "unleashes" the aircraft.

Will report back. 

Please do, but I don't think this will make a difference....

John

[Eugenio Remus]

Well John you wouldn't believe your eyes.

As soon as I turned FSUIPC off, the a/c resumed a normal climb, she got from 190 to 250 kias and reached 3500 fpm as a rate of climb.

But the first thing which happened: the "STAB OUT OF TRIM" yellow blinking light stopped blinking and went quiet.

So what does FSUIPC do to the stabilizer axis in order to "kidnap" him from the autopilot ?

Thanks for your kind attention.

Eu

p.s. when you have a chance, bring my best regards to your dad. He might remember one Italian fellow simmer who got in touch with him quite a few years ago to fine tune the tiller-to-rudder transition during the takeoff roll ....

[Eugenio Remus]

FYI, on a second trial, I did monitor the elevator trim value as soon as the climb got stuck and the STAB OUT OF TRIM light started to blink: it had been kept very close to zero ... 0,2, 0.5, 0.8, but as soon as I closed FSUIPC (and the light went off) the value started to increase, well beyond 1, and it soon reached 4 and above.

Also, I don't have any joystick axis assigned to the elevator trim.

 

[Eugenio Remus]

I think I found it.

I allowed the a/c to fly level without asking for any climb, but it couldn't speed up anyway. 

So I started to investigate the spoiler axis and it wasn't properly calibrated.

After calibration it would allow the a/c to speed up normally and even to climb.

So I will do more testing but I think we're on the right track.

Will let you know,

Thanks anyways

Eu

[John Dowson]

This is all very interesting....
It may be worth adding logging for various offsets for values that affect the speed - throttle/N1, flaps, spoilers, trim... so that we can see what these values are, If you again exit FSUIPC and the speed increases, if you then restart FSUIPC and the a/c looses speed we can see how/if these values change.

A few other points:
1. you have some strange assignments in your PMDG profile:

Quote

2=AZ,256,D,26,0,0,0    -{ DIRECT: (Unused) }-
5=BZ,256,D,26,0,0,0    -{ DIRECT: (Unused) }-

I have not seen this before....! Do you know what these are? I also see '(Unused)' in some of your axes range assignments...  I will check this...

2. Maybe also worth adding logging for axes values and repeating the tests with this logging added, but the log files will be pretty large.

3. Many folks have issues with FSUIPC calibration with PMDG aircraft due to priority levels. Maybe try switching your axes assignments to using 'Send to FS as normal axis' and removing/resetting any calibration in FSUIPC to see if this makes a difference.

14 hours ago, Eugenio Remus said:

p.s. when you have a chance, bring my best regards to your dad. He might remember one Italian fellow simmer who got in touch with him quite a few years ago to fine tune the tiller-to-rudder transition during the takeoff roll ....

Will do!

42 minutes ago, Eugenio Remus said:

So I will do more testing but I think we're on the right track.

Will let you know,

Ok. I don't have much time today, but I will look into this further when I can. Please keep me updated on anything you find...

John

[John Dowson]

1 hour ago, John Dowson said:

1. you have some strange assignments in your PMDG profile:

Quote

2=AZ,256,D,26,0,0,0    -{ DIRECT: (Unused) }-
5=BZ,256,D,26,0,0,0    -{ DIRECT: (Unused) }-

I have not seen this before....! Do you know what these are? I also see '(Unused)' in some of your axes range assignments...  I will check this...

Ok - Unused is an option in axes assignment when assigning direct to FSUIPC calibration. I guess this is used when there is no assignment to the axes itself, but when you have button control assignments to axes ranges. So this is nothing to worry about.