ActiveSky winds don't seem correct

[drskyking]

Hello Pete-

In the last few days you have quickly solved all my problems so I thought I would try something I am not sure is an ActiveSky problem or FSUIPC. I did as you suggested last night and launched FS2002, got setup with VATSIM, disabled real world weather from Squawkbox, cleared all weather from FS, loaded ActiveSky and refreshed a few minutes before takeoff. Have your most recent WideFS, FSUIPC and most recent pre-FS9 ActiveSky. I was flying at 17000 where the winds were from 305 at 58 kts, my aircraft had an IAS of 230, heading 252 to maintain a ground track of 278 and my GPS was saying a ground speed of 268! The GS and heading seemed the opposites of what they should have been, I expected a hefty right heading correction and significant loss of GS. Under advance weather settings the correct winds aloft were there. Any idea what may be happening? Cloud layers, temps, altimeter all were exact replicas of the "real world" from the metars enroute. Thanks again.

Doc

[Pete Dowson]

I was flying at 17000 where the winds were from 305 at 58 kts, my aircraft had an IAS of 230, heading 252 to maintain a ground track of 278 and my GPS was saying a ground speed of 268! The GS and heading seemed the opposites of what they should have been, I expected a hefty right heading correction and significant loss of GS. Under advance weather settings the correct winds aloft were there.

Where are you reading the wind details? Shift+Z tells you the ambient wind at the aircraft. In Fs2002 the direction shown is degrees True, not Magnetic. The winds aloft aren't in bands of fixed direction/speed, but vary between defined later "centres". On top of this if your have wind transitions and smoothing enabled those add other factors.

As you might now realise, it is really impossible for me to comment without a great deal more information. If the winds are set correctly in FS's own weather dialogues, then the other factors should follow, but you need to interpolate between layers even then.

Pete

[drskyking]

I was flying VATSIM, SB and AVC and ActiveSky were all running. I was getting the winds aloft from the winds aloft page from ActiveSky, checked them against AviationDigitalData, the numbers coincided. I disabled real world weather on SB and did not download any weather from FS and started with all weather cleared. I double checked, I was wrong the Advanced weather only showed me the correct surface winds. I also noticed on the ground that with all the data from ActiveSky the Activesky ATIS (122.00 with my airport) said winds 050/15, sky OVC 1500, FS tuned to the airport AWOS said 064/16, sky Broken 1900, vis and temp/alt were identical. I will try the shiftZ tonight to check winds aloft. When I looked at the winds under Advanced it showed the surface winds 064/16 to 99999 while I was on the ground. I am wondering if this is all expected. Thanks again.

[JSkorna]

Hi Doc,

What version of wxRE?

VATSIM METARs checked On?

Did you refresh the FS ATIS?

[Pete Dowson]

I double checked, I was wrong the Advanced weather only showed me the correct surface winds. I also noticed on the ground that with all the data from ActiveSky the Activesky ATIS (122.00 with my airport) said winds 050/15, sky OVC 1500, FS tuned to the airport AWOS said 064/16, sky Broken 1900, vis and temp/alt were identical.

So what's this to do with winds at 17000 feet? You seem to be reeling off loads of disconnected observations none of which helps paint a picture at all, far from it.

Where is AWOS? It isn't in my index of airports, nor in my Jeppesen database. If fact I cannot even determine what country it is in -- the AW prefix doesn't seem to be used.

What is the magnetic variation there? The METAR reports will be in degrees TRUE, the surface winds in FS2002 are in degrees magnetic usually. If the mag var is around 14 then they would match. The difference in speed between 15 and 16 is probably rounding and can be ignored.

The difference in cloudbase wouldn't be the ground level, would it? Perhaps one is AGL and the other AMSL -- I think some of that stuff is confused in FS in any case.

I'm not sure how any of this report possibly relates to your last one.

When I looked at the winds under Advanced it showed the surface winds 064/16 to 99999 while I was on the ground. I am wondering if this is all expected. Thanks again.

If you are using FSUIPC's wind transition facilities (or those are switched on by ActiveSky), then the FS winds are controlled purely by having only one FS layer. This allows FSUIPC to control the smoothing which can otherwise be a problem in FS's own layering. Please take a look at the FSUIPC User Guide some time. A lot of this is explained there.

Pete

[drskyking]

Sorry to sound so disconnected. I have read the excellent users guide several times and have done all the suggestions and ActiveSky's suggestions. It is v1.92.4, atis refreshed. I am in NY, USA, variation is +14. If FS ATIS ( I was calling it A-automated W-weather O-observation S-station and that is what we call it at our local airport KSCH on freq 119.27) is giving the info in MSL instead of AGL the cloud bases jibe. I think it is all running correctly. I will experiment with the winds aloft another time. Seems if ActiveSky and ADDS was reporting the winds at 17000 305/58 then they were from 319 mag and my course was around 272 mag there should have been more of a right correction needed instead of the left crab, I still can't imagine why with the heavy headwind my groundspeed was so much faster that IAS which I realize is much less than true at that altitude. I will have to get the E6B out and check it out. I am sure it is working perfectly, as an active SEL IFR pilot I love all your products, again, great job!!!

Regards, Doc

[drskyking]

Thanks Jim, VATSIM Metars were checked. I think the issue is the true vs mag and AGL v MSL. Does FS report clouds MSL in their ATIS'?? Good night!

Doc

[Pete Dowson]

I am in NY, USA, variation is +14.

Ah, there you go, then. That's the winds explained.

If FS ATIS ( I was calling it A-automated W-weather O-observation S-station and that is what we call it at our local airport KSCH on freq 119.27) is giving the info in MSL instead of AGL the cloud bases jibe. I think it is all running correctly.

Ah, I was reading the "airport AWOS" as identifying the airport! :wink:

Unfortunately, FS2002 uses AMSL for its cloudbases, throughout -- including, most incorrectly, its ATIS reports. You can check this yourself -- in the Advanced Weather dialogues the values are AMSL, with the aircraft shown at its appropriate altidude in the graphic even if it is on the ground. The "Base" value in the dialogue is AMSL. Compare that with your ATIS report.

I will experiment with the winds aloft another time. Seems if ActiveSky and ADDS was reporting the winds at 17000 305/58 then they were from 319 mag and my course was around 272 mag there should have been more of a right correction needed instead of the left crab

Yes, but where was what reporting the winds at 17000? Is 17000 exactly one of the levels listed in the upper winds list?

The winds aren't "fixed" in static layers, but blend into each other as you climb or descend. This is why I suggested using Shift+Z to find the ambient wind actually present at the aircraft.

With a good weather program like ActiveSky you will also get the winds changing as you fly between METAR stations, so unless you are directly above the Lat/Lon of the station reporting the wind you are reading, it won't necessarily apply in any case. The wind could be changing to match the METAR reports of the other stations around you.

Regards

Pete

[drskyking]

Thanks so much. Those questions have been bugging me for a year. I am an IFR pilot and love practicing my approaches near my home airport and would often get frustrated seeing beautiful IFR weather with a ceiling of 300 feet and 1.5 m visibility out my window, logging onto FS and finding they dumped in a scattered layer at 2500 with 40 miles vis!! What a great resource you are. I have been doing this so long, I must have read in the past and forgotton how FS and ActiveSky handled winds and ceiling reports!

That wideFS of yours is awesome with a laptop and wireless router. I now have my local flight buddies all doing it, FS on desktop with the servinfo gauge on the panels, then ActiveSky, Squawkbox, AVC, AVC tuner and Sevinfo on the laptop. We get together on VATSIM or IVAO and as far as we are concerned it is as "real as it gets"!

Have a great weekend!

Doc