P3Dv5/PMDG777 - No respond from Honeycomb throttles reverser buttons

[Morten]

Hi there

All controllers are disabled within the FS settings. FSUIPC is used as the only entrance. Everything works great. Just having problems via FSUIPC to make the reverser buttons (9 and 10) to work for Honeycomb/PMDG 777 with v5.

Same FSUIPC settings for v4 which works just fine.

Wonder what's going on?

/Morten  

[John Dowson]

 Are you using the same assignments in v4 both and v5?
Maybe try logging buttons and keys, events and axes controls on both v4 and v5 and compare the logs on the two versions to see if there is any difference.

[Morten]

Hi John

Thanks for your answer.

As it is, I copied most of the FSUIPC.ini for v4 into the FSUIPC.ini for v5.
Strange however as I can't see any trace of the reverse buttons in either the v4 nor v5 inis/logs..!
At the same time I noticed, as mentioned before, that the reverser buttons works as expected in v4, but NOT at all in v5!

In addition to this I might add that I previously implemented both versions with a Aerosoft PMDG 777 preset file into the Honeycomb configurator tool.
So could it maybe be turns out that this Aerosoft preset file actually overrule certain button configurations disregarded whatever buttons I try to assign trough FSUIPC..?! 

Cheers Morten    
   

 

 

FSUIPC6_P3Dv4.ini FSUIPC6_P3Dv5.ini FSUIPC6_P3Dv4.log FSUIPC6_P3Dv5.log

[Pete Dowson]

4 hours ago, Morten said:

In addition to this I might add that I previously implemented both versions with a Aerosoft PMDG 777 preset file into the Honeycomb configurator tool.
So could it maybe be turns out that this Aerosoft preset file actually overrule certain button configurations disregarded whatever buttons I try to assign trough FSUIPC..?! 

No. The only buttons you have assigned are these:

[Buttons]
ButtonRepeat=20,10
PollInterval=25
2=PA,11,Cx050078E7,x32     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
3=PA,12,Cx050078E7,x64     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
4=PA,13,Cx050078E7,x80     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
5=RA,3,C65615,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_UP}-
6=RA,2,C65607,0     -{ELEV_TRIM_DN}-
7=PA,5,C65758,0     -{FLAPS_INCR}-
8=PA,4,C65759,0     -{FLAPS_DECR}-

I don't know what offset 78E7 is being used for in your system, but apart from those three offset changes (which don't appear to make any sense), the Trim and the Flaps, there are no others assigned in either INI file, so probably you only assigned in that Honeycomb tool.

You need always to be very wary of using more than one program for assignments. It is is easy to gey duplicate and therefore conflicting assignments, and it is also easy to confuse which is doing what. Just as with P3D v FSUIPC assignments where we strongly recommend only using one for assignments.

Pete

 

[John Dowson]

18 hours ago, Morten said:

Strange however as I can't see any trace of the reverse buttons in either the v4 nor v5 inis/logs..!

You need to activate logging for Events to see the reverse control being sent. However, as Pete has said, you have no assignments to this in FSUIPC so must be controlled from somewhere else, either the Honeycomb config app or P3D. You can still activate logging to see what events are being used though, and this may show you the difference between your v4 and v5 configs.

Your FSUIPC6 is also out-of-date. You should upgrade to the latest version, v6.1.1 - only the latest version is supported.

John

[Morten]

Hi there

As stated before ALL P3D internal controllers are disabled for BOTH v4 and 5, despite this fact and the fact that NO button action regarding the reverse button 9 and 10 is present neither in FSUIPC nor inside P3D internal controllers, reverse buttons 9 and 10 anyway is fully working anyway in v4 (but not in v5)!

I've tried several times to assign those two buttons for reverse throttle 1 and 2 v5 inside FSUIPC - without any success. Please guide me, as something seems to go wrong! 

[Morten]

In addition to the issue, I just upgraded the "latest" FSUIPC version 6.11 version from the official download page  http://www.fsuipc.com/ - however when going through the automatic uninstall/ reinstall procedure, latest FSUIPC version now shows up, in both V4 and v5 as 6.0.13...?!
Now what is that all about?!

Anyway, tried again for a million times, to assign reverse buttons to v5 - still without any luck! Think you got an issue here?!  

  

[Pete Dowson]

46 minutes ago, Morten said:

As stated before ALL P3D internal controllers are disabled for BOTH v4 and 5, despite this fact and the fact that NO button action regarding the reverse button 9 and 10 is present neither in FSUIPC nor inside P3D internal controllers, reverse buttons 9 and 10 anyway is fully working anyway in v4 (but not in v5)!

Sorry, but with no assignment FSUIPC cannot possibly be doing this is either V4 or V5. So anything you have happening with those buttons is being done elsewhere. presumably with that configurator tool.

The only button assignment you can really use for Reverse is to Throttle1 Decr and Throttle2 Decr. Or keypress F2 for all engines. Otherwise you could try using a reverse zone on the throttle axes, though I don't think that works on PMDG Boeings.

Why haven't you activated the event logging as Johnrequested, and supplied the resulting logs?

26 minutes ago, Morten said:

Anyway, tried again for a million times, to assign reverse buttons to v5 - still without any luck! Think you got an issue here?!  

No, sorry, I think it seems that it is you who has an issue. Perhaps you can describe a just a few of those million attempts? Maybe we can tell you where you are going wrong? And please do explain what you are attempting with these button assignments:

2=PA,11,Cx050078E7,x32     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
3=PA,12,Cx050078E7,x64     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
4=PA,13,Cx050078E7,x80     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-

which, even if offset 78E7 was doing anything, don't appear to do much constructive as they just set, not change or clear, bits.

Pete
 

 

[John Dowson]

9 hours ago, Morten said:

In addition to the issue, I just upgraded the "latest" FSUIPC version 6.11 version from the official download page  http://www.fsuipc.com/ - however when going through the automatic uninstall/ reinstall procedure, latest FSUIPC version now shows up, in both V4 and v5 as 6.0.13...?!
Now what is that all about?!

Sorry, I don't understand this.  Please show me your InstallFSUIPC6.log file.
Are you using the same installation folder for both v4 and v5, or separate folders? If you use the same folder, both v4 and v5v will use the same configuration (i.e. only one FSUIPC6.ini) and therefore cannot be any different. If you use different folders, you will have two InstallFSUIPC6.log files - attach them both please.

Also, please confirm that you are looking at the correct 'installation' folder. If you don't know where this is, the best way to verify is to go to the FSUIPC logging tab and click the 'Open Folder' button. Do this on both v4b and v5.

 

[Morten]

On 5/21/2021 at 12:25 AM, Pete Dowson said:

The only button assignment you can really use for Reverse is to Throttle1 Decr and Throttle2 Decr.

THAT did the trick!

On 5/21/2021 at 12:25 AM, Pete Dowson said:

No, sorry, I think it seems that it is you who has an issue. Perhaps you can describe a just a few of those million attempts? Maybe we can tell you where you are going wrong? And please do explain what you are attempting with these button assignments:

2=PA,11,Cx050078E7,x32     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
3=PA,12,Cx050078E7,x64     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-
4=PA,13,Cx050078E7,x80     -{offset byte setbits, offset 78E7}-

Have no idea! Nothing done on purpose here from my hand or at least I don't remember. Anyway, now deleted!

On 5/21/2021 at 9:43 AM, John Dowson said:

Sorry, I don't understand this.  Please show me your InstallFSUIPC6.log file.
Are you using the same installation folder for both v4 and v5, or separate folders? If you use the same folder, both v4 and v5v will use the same configuration (i.e. only one FSUIPC6.ini) and therefore cannot be any different. If you use different folders, you will have two InstallFSUIPC6.log files - attach them both please.

Also, please confirm that you are looking at the correct 'installation' folder. If you don't know where this is, the best way to verify is to go to the FSUIPC logging tab and click the 'Open Folder' button. Do this on both v4b and v5.

I have separate folders for v4 and v5 as shown on the attached screenshots.
When trying to install both for v4 and for v5 at the same time the installer ignores v4, but installs correctly into the v5 addon folder .
When trying to install to v4 alone your auto installer don't point to the correct location - instead it points to v5! (No option here to change directories) Resulting in an empty v4 folder, except for a faulty add-on.xml file pointing wrongly to the v5 path instead of the v4 path (see attachment).
Due to those facts mentioned above there's only one Install log regarding to v5, but none whatsoever regarding to v4 (only install log for v5 attached here)

Looking into the old module location for v4 everything is untouched here, including the old FSUIPC version 6.0.13 which also shows up in P3Dv4 at present! 

So how do I get on from here?!

/Morten  

   

add-on.xml InstallFSUIPC6.log

[Pete Dowson]

8 hours ago, Morten said:

When trying to install both for v4 and for v5 at the same time the installer ignores v4, but installs correctly into the v5 addon folder .
When trying to install to v4 alone your auto installer don't point to the correct location - instead it points to v5! (No option here to change directories) Resulting in an empty v4 folder, except for a faulty add-on.xml file pointing wrongly to the v5 path instead of the v4 path (see attachment).
Due to those facts mentioned above there's only one Install log regarding to v5, but none whatsoever regarding to v4 (only install log for v5 attached here)

Looking into the old module location for v4 everything is untouched here, including the old FSUIPC version 6.0.13 which also shows up in P3Dv4 at present! 

So how do I get on from here?!

This sounds like there's no proper entry for P3Dv4 in the registry. Not sure how you managed that but the easy way to fix it is to use Windows Settings - Apps to uninstall just the Prepar3D v4 Client, then rerun just the "Install_Client.msi" file which you'll have in the original downloaded ZIP for V4. That'll just replace the main V4 module/exe and update the registry. It won't harm or change anything else, and you can do it retaining your P3D registration (such an option is offered).

Otherwise it's a little more messy -- editing the Registry yourself.

All that's the best way as it will also assist many other installers which need to find installations via correct registry entries. 

The other way would be to copy the FSUIPC6 folder from the Prepar3D v5 Add-Ons folder to the Prepar3D v4 Add-Ons folder. hat would actually work with no further action, and use your same settings (the one FSUIPC6 install folder) for both. If you still really want different settings for each then you'd need to edit the Add-on.xml file to change the path accordingly. That's in an entry like this: <Path>E:\FSUIPC6\FSUIPC6.dll</Path>.

Pete

 

[Morten]

Okay Pete, thanks for your profound examination of alternative workarounds...
I actually thought of the copying alternative myself, which is the most obvious alternative, for now and here. But if you have some precise input for the registry for the long run, I would appreciate a PM about those values as I'm use to deal with the registry (taken backup prior to this, of course).

Besides this, I noticed that your update uninstaller/(reinstaller) had been inside my old P3Dv4 module and partly delete essential files in here and ruined the values for all joysticks in function regarding to P3Dv4.
By mounting an earlier image backup and copying files from there into the module folder, I was then able to get things to work again. However this situation is obviously rather inappropriate regarding to future updates from your hand, so I better make changes to the registry as soon as possible!

/Morten       

    

[John Dowson]

Hi Morten,

I responded to this yesterday but all my posts from yesterday have gone missing for some reason...

I think you are misunderstanding the installer and where things are installed. The installation log you posted showed the installation went fine.

When installing for P3Dv4 and P3Dv5, you have two alternatives: have one FSUIPC installation for both versions, or have separate installations for both versions (by running the installer twice). This is all explained in the provided Installation and Registration manual. Please read this.

On 5/23/2021 at 1:16 AM, Morten said:

I have separate folders for v4 and v5 as shown on the attached screenshots.
When trying to install both for v4 and for v5 at the same time the installer ignores v4, but installs correctly into the v5 addon folder .

This was basically incorrect and a misunderstanding on your part, as shown by your installation log, which shows that you opted to install FSUIPC6 for both P3Dv4 and P3Dv5, and you selected (or accepted) your P3Dv5 add-ons folder for the installation folder:

Quote

Output folder: C:\Users\Bruger\Documents\Prepar3D v5 Add-ons\FSUIPC6
Extract: FSUIPC6.dll... 100%
Installing DLL with InstallType=AddOn
FSUIPC6 dll file installed in C:\Users\Bruger\Documents\Prepar3D v5 Add-ons\FSUIPC6.
XML-add-on installation was selected - no DLL.xml update needed.
FSUIPC6.dll installation completed.

So the installation for both v4 and v5 is that folder: C:\Users\Bruger\Documents\Prepar3D v5 Add-ons\FSUIPC6.
i.e. your P3Dv5 add-on xml folder.

It is better to select a different folder during installation, something like C:\FSUIPC6 or C:\P3D Add-ons\FSUIPC6, and keep your GSUIPC6 installation folder separate from your add-on.xml, which is the file used by P3D to auto-start FSUIPC6. The location of this file is defined by P3D.

10 hours ago, Morten said:

Besides this, I noticed that your update uninstaller/(reinstaller) had been inside my old P3Dv4 module and partly delete essential files in here and ruined the values for all joysticks in function regarding to P3Dv4.

The installer/uninstaller does not change or remove any files, including your settings, other than those it has installed/creates during installation. In no way can it delete "essential files". You will be looking in the wrong location, or must have deleted them manually.
 

Please read the Installation and Registration document. If you want separate folders for each P3D version, you must run the installer twice, once for each version.

[Morten]

Hi John

Let's end this discussion and stick to the conclusion from Pete that something seems to be wrong with me registry.

As straight forward as your installer is, it should be hard to misunderstand.
I do not intend to repeat here what I already wrote in detail about my experience with the installation process!

The bottom line is that I already tried both installation options: 
1. v4 and v5 in the same installation process
2. Separate installation processes for each versions of v4 and v5
The result for both these options, was that the only installation process that succeeded was for v5.
The installation for v4 did NOT succeed in any way as the automatic path pointed wrongly into the v5 folder. And as you haven't made it possible for the user to change paths to the correct folder, both installation options turned out to fail for v4.

Anyway, for now I made an instant solution for v4, by copying the content from the v5 folder to the v4 folder, and from inside here edited the add-on.xml to correct v4 path.
So everything now works perfect!       

/Morten                   

[John Dowson]

15 minutes ago, Morten said:

The installation for v4 did NOT succeed in any way as the automatic path pointed wrongly into the v5 folder. And as you haven't made it possible for the user to change paths to the correct folder, both installation options turned out to fail for v4.

It pointed to that folder as that was the previous installation location (as you had it installed there for both v4 and v5) and the installer will always default to the previous installation location. But it IS possible for you to change this - the installation page after the component selection page (in the installer) is the 'Choose Install Location' page, where you can select the destination folder by using the Browse... button.

What you cannot change is the location of the add-on.xml file, as this is defined by P3D.

The problems you encountered were due to the fact that you installed for both v4 and v5, so used a single installation folder. When you ran the installer again, to install v4 into a different folder, this would have ran the uninstaller first and uninstalled, and then the default folder for the v4 install would be the v5 folder. You could have changed this, but didn't. And it would have also replaced the uninstaller (*for both v4 and v5) in that location with the v4 uninstaller just created. If you then ran the installer again, to install for v5, this would detect the v4 uninstaller and run that, so v4 would be uninstalled when installing v5. 

So, the problem in the installation/uninstallation is that if you want to switch back from using a shared installation for both v4 and v5 to separate installations, you should first manually run the uninstaller to remove and then run the installer twice, once for v4 and once for v5.

34 minutes ago, Morten said:

Anyway, for now I made an instant solution for v4, by copying the content from the v5 folder to the v4 folder, and from inside here edited the add-on.xml to correct v4 path.
So everything now works perfect!       

Well, you may have problems in future (when updating) doing this as the FSUIPC registry entries will not be correct. You should delete and use the installer. Uninstall everything first (using the uninstaller first and then manually removing everything), and then install again using the installer, running it twice if separate installations required.

And it is highly recommended to choose an installation folder outside of your P3D add-ons folder, and outside of a windows protected folder, e.g. C:\P3D Add-ons#FSUIPC6 (for shared location) or C:\P3Dv4 Add-ons\FSUIPC6 (for v4 only location).

 

[Morten]

On 5/25/2021 at 10:17 AM, John Dowson said:

But it IS possible for you to change this - the installation page after the component selection page (in the installer) is the 'Choose Install Location' page, where you can select the destination folder by using the Browse... button.

John if you are referring to the dialog box as shown down here as a "Browse" option, it is NOT possible to change any path in there! 

Choosing specifically P3Dv4 brings me to next dialog box which defaults uninstallation through a wrong path, which I'm not able to change.        

[John Dowson]

11 hours ago, Morten said:

Choosing specifically P3Dv4 brings me to next dialog box which defaults uninstallation through a wrong path, which I'm not able to change.        

That is the uninstaller. You cannot change that - it uninstalls from the locations where you installed. If you select P3Dv4, it will uninstall from the P3Dv4 location. If you select P3Dv5, it will uninstall from the P3Dv5 location. If you select both, it will uninstall from both.
As I have said, a problem arises if you previously installed a single installation for both P3Dv4 and P3Dv5, but then just uninstall (or re-install) for one location, and change the installation folder. If you do this, it will uninstall the shared copy, then re-install a copy just for the version selected.

So, if you previously installed a single copy for both versions, it is best to manually run the installer and uninstall for both versions. Then run the installer twice, and install for each version in a different location.

It is the installation location you should choose, not the uninstall location.

[Morten]

John, I have no more patience to go on with another uninstall/reinstall experiment in order to verify your statement, passing through to your reinstall statement.
That is, now when everything is working per copy/past from one folder another, editing XML files and so on  - so I rather tend to believe you, as I don't remember my struggle in every detail anymore when tried to install this update.
All I know John, is that you at least ought to tie up some of your odd bindings, for instance let one being able to browse to the correct folder in the uninstall phase. 

Cheers,
Morten       

[John Dowson]

5 minutes ago, Morten said:

All I know John, is that you at least ought to tie up some of your odd bindings, for instance let one being able to browse to the correct folder in the uninstall phase. 

But that makes no sense. An uninstaller ALWAYS uninstalls from the location you selected when you install.
This obviously (if you think about it) presents issues when you have installed once for two versions of the app, then want to uninstall for one. Its just not possible.
And, this  IS a problem in the installer that allows you to do this. I am going to update the installer so that it detects if you have installed a single copy for use by both versions then it will not allow you to deselect a version to re-install - it must be for both. And I will update the Installation and Registration guide to explain this, and what you must do if you want to revert to separate installations, i.e. you have to manually run the uninstaller first.

Sorry, but this is just a scenario I hadn't considered when I decided to allow a single installation for both P3D versions.

You may, more than likely, get problems next time you choose to update one of your installations. I think it would be better to sort this out now when its fresh, rather than having further issues when there is an update you need to install. But thats up to you.

Cheers,

John

[Morten]

All good John!
Life isn't exactly getting easier for none of us with P3D choosing to do such a basically complete gamechanger update from v4 to an immature v5, which force everyone of us to keep both versions until they get v5 fully working in every aspect!

I deeply appreciate all of you developers making a great effort to cope up with this dragging mess!  

Cheers,
Morten